The Gamer's Quarter

[Nana Komatsu]

So I've been following the press for Kirby Dick's documentary This Film Is Not Yet Rated for a while now and find myself more and more interested in it. Ever since I turned 17, I stopped really paying attention to film ratings, but now with a new-found interest in independent film it makes sense to me how much film ratings can make or break an independent film maker.

Reading this wired news article got me wondering: Is the ESRB this secretive? I can't recall many games being given an AO rating (BMX XXX and San Andreas come to mind) but I know very little about the ESRB and have sort of always taken their ratings for granted as well.

[dhex]

they seem to mostly be concerned with making sure nothing too controversial or "adult" (much less adult) gets published, worried that hillarity c. is looking over their shoulder.

i can understand why, it's an industry that doesn't really thrive on genuine controversy, much less the uncomfortable glare of political grandstanding. sure, they're wussies, but hey, what can you do?
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[Scratchmonkey]

It works much the same as the the movie ratings in that sex is considered far more "adult" than violence, drugs are a huge no-no and nobody wants to get stuck with an "AO" rating because it's the kiss of death (and generally everybody wants to get the lowest rating possible because that gives you a bigger market to sell to).

[SuperWes]

My understanding is that the ESRB was set up by the ESA in order to regulate game ratings so that the government doesn't step in and do it for them. This is significant because it means that it was done specifically to keep the ratings standards in the hands of the industry rather than the government. BMXXX was actually rated M, not AO, because it needed to get shelf space at major retailers. I have heard that they worked very closely with not only the ESRB, but also Sony, Microsoft, and Nintendo in order to achieve a certain set of standards. Believe it or not, the Gamecube version is actually the one that allows you to get the girls the most nekked, probably to make up for the whole Mortal Kombat years. Knowing this fact I think we can assume that the console manufacturers probably play a bigger role in defining standards than the ESRB does.

Come to think of it, the only mainstreamish AO games I can think of (aside from San Andreas, which sort of doesn't count) have been Singles: Flirt Up Your Life, and the AO version of Leisure Suit Larry: Magna Cum Laude. Both of these were released as digital downloads in their AO versions and in stores as a toned down, M-rated version.

Here's a FAQ about the ESRB. I would guess that the most restrictive issues indie developers might have with the ESRB would be the costs required to get something rated. I believe that it costs a lot (not by publisher standards, but by indie developers standards) to get a game rated, and most Indie developers/publishers probably just ignore the system and release their games as digital downloads. If an indie game is big enough to see retail release it probably gets paid for and handled by the publisher so that they don't have to worry about it. But really, what indie games that have questionable content get published and distributed anyways? Probably not many.

I don't think we have anything to worry about as far as scandals go, but it's something that might matter in the future as indie developers begin doing more work on consoles through Live Arcade and what not.

-Wes
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[Scratchmonkey]

[GSL]

Possibly one reason for the lack of AO titles (at least in physical-product form) is the fact that most retailers will not sell them. It's been about a year since I left Gamestop, but at the time they would not stock AO-rated titles, which by extension means Software Etc., Funcoland, and all the EB stores did not carry them. It's been a year, but I doubt company policy would really change in that regard. And then you have places like Wal-Mart, which is a total Nazi state concerning 'explicit lyrics' on the CDs they sell, so it's kind of a no-brainer that they'd never touch anything AO rated. At this time in the gaming industry, there's very little if any profit to be had in pushing anything with such a rating--especially in light of lousy examples like Magna Cum Laude.

As for the whole sex-vs.-gratuitious violence thing that always seems to pop up when people talk of ratings: my take on it is that it's much less of a "violence is better/more acceptable than sex" issue than it is an issue of--well, let's say education. I mean, unless you were raised in some sort of indiginous cannibal tribe in some part of world that time forgot, you most likely as a child were taught that killing people is a bad thing, and that getting killed is bad if not worse. Of course, you have the unhinged bad eggs that go on school shootings and whatnot, but for the most part, 'do not kill/maim/injure' is a fairly universal creed. The portrayal of sex, on the other hand, is a lot more iffy. It's not something most kids are taught about from an early age (which could spur a whole seperate line of discussion which is not the point right now), and it's a topic that isn't so clearly defined. Obviously, a family's religious beliefs are going to play a big part in how and in what context sexual activity is accepted, but let's move beyond that: in most R-rated action movies, people are shot, exploded knifed, etc.; when you're watching the movie, the concept of violence leading to death or injury is reinforced. But in the action movie where the hero always gets the gorgeous girl (Bond movies, as an off-the-cuff example), the sex is always great, there's little to no emotional attachment, and nobody ever gets pregnant or herpes. Sex as portrayed in movies and games is arguably much more unrealistic--in concept--than violence, and almost demands that the audience recognize that in real life, if you try to emulate Connery you'll be paying child support in ten different nations and spent the rest of your life with a scorching case of warts, if not worse. But younger audiences, especially those who haven't had The Talk with mom and dad or whatever might not be able to visualize the repercussions of their potential actions because hey, it all works out great in the movies/games. I'm not sure that the crackdown on sex in the ratings system is truly indicative of the attitude that sex is a much more horrible thing than violence, but rather that it's a thorny issue that will vary from person to person in its interpretation; high ratings for movies and games featuring that content are--ostensibly, as we all know--just a way for the industry to try and restrict consumption of this media to people who are--presumably--old enough to know the difference between real life and this kind of fantasy.

Just my 0.155548 HKD.

[Scratchmonkey]

Well, if you want to hinge it to societal views of sex, then you have to go down the whole "America-is-a-country-founded-by-Puritans" road, which frankly I've been down a little often.

I just knows that shooting a guy is still okay for Teens; Boobs are for Adults.

[Swimmy]

It has fuck all to do with Puritans. It has everything to do with being able to punch your sister before you can pop a boner.
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"Ayn Rand fans are the old school version of Xenogears fanboys."
-seryogin

[GSL]

[simplicio]

[Harveyjames]

I don't know. You had to 'push the left analog stick in rhythm' and keep the excitement level up. You'd think there was some kind of penalty for getting it wrong, but one of the videos I watched on Youtube had the player pressing the 'change position' button extremely rapidly so the woman looked like she was doing a kind of spastic robot dance, and he still got 'you da man' at the end of it.

[dhex]

there are far too many examples of the religious history of a country being at odds with its present state to explain why games don't really approach sex very well, if at all. (the netherlands, as a random example.)

then again, that's probably mostly a blessing, isn't it?
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[Harveyjames]

Maybe. Some of the more ambitious longer-form narrative games, like Deus Ex, seemed to suffer for their lack of sex. If ever a man needed to get laid it was JC Denton.

[GSL]

Or Gordon Freeman. I mean, come on, the man is a raging font of libido.

[Dracko]

I'd rather have controversial ideas tossed in my direction than meaningless violence.

I must sound crazy thanks to that one, because extreme cinema has a special place in my heart. I just don't think gaming needs its own extreme, at least not yet.
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"This is the most fun I've ever had without being drenched in the blood of my enemies!"

[Shapermc]

Sex used well in a game: Killer 7

Sex used as though a 12 year old wrote it in: God of War

Sex is in games and used well. Some people might be trying to take their games seriously and not putting in sex because they feel they can't handle the content well. I know that I can't handle sex well in my writing so I usually just don't incorperate it into my stories. It is a tool that can be used skillfully or poorly, it is sometimes best to just not use it. But it can get past the ESRB with an appropriate rating. Immature sex is probably worse for a 12 year old than immature violence.

(we could attempt to relate this to cartoons and stuff like Wily E. Coyote [where kids know that the violence isn't real and not something to try, as opposed to if Wily E. Coyote was having promiscuious sex with the road runner: children don't know about sex yet and how it will effect their lives, they do know that when you hit someone with a stick that they cry] but I don't think that will work)
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“The average man has a secret desire to be a swaggering, drunken, fighting, raping swashbuckler.”
-Robert E. Howard in a letter to a friend circa Decmber 1932

"There is no place in this enterprise for a rogue physicist!"

[dhex]

[OtakupunkX]

[Harveyjames]

[Lackey]

Sex of the moment would probably work okay in a plot-driven cinematic game like that. Relationship is much harder to simulate.

I think the sex scene in God of War perfect because it was exactly as gratuitous as the rest of the game.
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| Little bird fighting against a bat sect game |

[dhex]

[TheRumblefish]