The Gamer's Quarter

Winged Assassins (1984) · Posted: Sun Dec 16, 2007 2:04 am Post subject:

Yeah, there's a hell of a lot of shit in ROTT which really asks a lot of you to look past and it all boils down to the levels. I used to get horribly lost in it's almost "Wolfenstein 3D Pacman episode 3 secret level-ness" but I've played the game so many times now I can get through it with very few mistakes (I've even managed to find all the super secret D-I-P balls which are almost nigh on impossible to find without a walkthrough) and you really need to complete the game a few times before you can start to recall what you need to do. I think this is the main reason why they made the game so violent. It's like Mortal Kombat to DooM's Street Fighter II, they distract you from the flawed parts with all this claret flying about the joint but eventually you start seeing that as window dressing and you begin to pick out all the bad parts. There is enjoyment to be had but there's this lingering thought that it could have been much better. But if you are like me you soon forget the bum design and only concentrate on making things explode whilst you zip about at speed trying to be a dog.

And if you think those guys with the machineguns and grenades were bad wait until you face the invincible robots in episode 3 and the boss which spams you with about a hundred rockets at once, he's a bastard he is.

Shapermc · Hot Sake! Joined: 14 Oct 2004 Posts: 6279

I made a comment once to Dhex that Painkiller just seemed like a shooting gallery. After an impulse buy (and being broke) i've found out that he failed to mention that it's a brilliant fucking shooting gallery.
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“The average man has a secret desire to be a swaggering, drunken, fighting, raping swashbuckler.”
-Robert E. Howard in a letter to a friend circa Decmber 1932

"There is no place in this enterprise for a rogue physicist!"

Cycle · Mac daddy Joined: 08 Sep 2006 Posts: 2767

Man, I remember getting in a HEATED ARGUEMENT with deusjester over at IC about Painkiller. I said it was rubbish and he accused me of not playing the game because CLEARLY ANYONE WHO PLAYED IT WOULDN'T THINK SO!

Anyway, that's another game that suffers from ROTTitess. Seems like a pool of awesome ideas, without a good game built around them. I honestly thought it was pretty terrible! Repeitive, boring, zero atmosphere, with apparently zero thought put into the level design.

The variety of levels/enemies, destructable environments and some of the weapons were awesome, though. I just hated the core gameplay.
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Shapermc · Hot Sake! Joined: 14 Oct 2004 Posts: 6279

please expand on what's wrong with "the core gameplay" because... like, all you do is shoot stuff.

"The variety of levels/enemies, destructable environments and some of the weapons were awesome, though."

That's the best part. Playing it in small chunks keeps it very entertaining because it's so varied from section to section. It also has boss fights that don't feel like cop-outs. I mean, with the above sentence I would claim that it's great, because 50 enemies on screen chasing you while you just mow them over is great fun.
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“The average man has a secret desire to be a swaggering, drunken, fighting, raping swashbuckler.”
-Robert E. Howard in a letter to a friend circa Decmber 1932

"There is no place in this enterprise for a rogue physicist!"

dhex · Posted: Sun Dec 16, 2007 6:14 pm Post subject:

the level design is fairly shit, yeah.
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Cycle · Mac daddy Joined: 08 Sep 2006 Posts: 2767

Perhaps I'm more picky than other FPS gamers, but a game needs more than "just shoot stuff" to keep me entertained. As Eugene Jarvis once said, creating a 3D environment and filling it with enemies does not a good game make!

The problem is that instead of having a smaller amount of well designed, focused enemies that work together to make interesting waves (like Serious Sam for example), each level just have their own one to three enemy types, with barely any variety. Like that opera house level where you just mow down the same ninjas through the whole level. It was boring and not terribly challenging, neither!

I also remember the weapons not being fast enough for me.

Plus I hate how they screw the atmosphere. At first you have these incredibly moody environments and spooky music, but as soon as an enemy appears they start playing shitty rock music and it's just like, "oh."

BUT YES, the boss battles were pretty awesome! Best part of the game, really.
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Shapermc · Hot Sake! Joined: 14 Oct 2004 Posts: 6279

Yes, but they're varied. I mean, there are much worse levels out there for games. The whole point is just getting you into a hallway or opening so you can shoot a lot of stuff.

EDIT for Cycle: It's just excellent visceral fun. It's nothing complex or meaty, it's just mindless and frantic. It works well enough for me. I'm not saying it's gods gift to man or anything. It reminds me more of light gun games mixed with gauntlet turned into an FPS.
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“The average man has a secret desire to be a swaggering, drunken, fighting, raping swashbuckler.”
-Robert E. Howard in a letter to a friend circa Decmber 1932

"There is no place in this enterprise for a rogue physicist!"

Winged Assassins (1984) · Posted: Sun Dec 16, 2007 6:21 pm Post subject:

The level design suffers from arena shooteritis just like Serious Sam did. If they avoided this and just had enemies that were in set positions in the level like with other first-person shooter with a minute amount of respawning enemies dotted about it would have been a much better game because they really nailed the atmosphere. It's just a shame the above faults bring it down a bit.

But hey, you can just have a chuckle with the physics and persevere with the game until you get to the asylum level, then it's just a matter of sitting through the next lot of levels until you get to the last one which is one of the best last levels ever done in a game.
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Shapermc · Hot Sake! Joined: 14 Oct 2004 Posts: 6279

Also, this only ran $10. And i've paid more for much less entertaining games. The price probably does add to my enjoyment of it.
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“The average man has a secret desire to be a swaggering, drunken, fighting, raping swashbuckler.”
-Robert E. Howard in a letter to a friend circa Decmber 1932

"There is no place in this enterprise for a rogue physicist!"

Cycle · Mac daddy Joined: 08 Sep 2006 Posts: 2767

I like visceral fun, even mindless games, but Painkiller just lacked that spark for me. I mean, for one thing shooting galleries require sharp aiming, something that isn't required in Painkiller, plus, well, there was just no tension! It was just guys charging you and mowing them down. I played on the... second hardest difficulty, I think, and I just plowed through the levels effortlessly. The whole experience felt so empty.
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Shapermc · Hot Sake! Joined: 14 Oct 2004 Posts: 6279

Like empty calories.

Painkiller the candybar.
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“The average man has a secret desire to be a swaggering, drunken, fighting, raping swashbuckler.”
-Robert E. Howard in a letter to a friend circa Decmber 1932

"There is no place in this enterprise for a rogue physicist!"

Cycle · Mac daddy Joined: 08 Sep 2006 Posts: 2767

I think what got me the most was that DJ kept saying it was the modern day DooM II, and I just don't see how they are at all similar. DooM II required much more brains! It also had actual level design!

Anyway, I'm glad you enjoyed Painkiller! I know many people who did, but I guess it was just a little too shallow for me. You should play the original Serious Sam, too! I think it's the better of the ARCADE FPS genre that was popular a couple eyars back.

The Asylum level was neat, though.
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Winged Assassins (1984) · Posted: Sun Dec 16, 2007 6:38 pm Post subject:

dhex · Posted: Sun Dec 16, 2007 8:07 pm Post subject:

kirkjerk · . Joined: 12 Apr 2006 Posts: 1227

Cycle · Mac daddy Joined: 08 Sep 2006 Posts: 2767

well i just played three adventures in a row so i just want to shoot stuff now and give my brain a break.

im thinking of playing through stalker again (patched) (also this game has been forgotten in all the GAME OF THE YEAR awards, i probably enjoyed it more than bioshock)

or maybe daikatana
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Scratchmonkey · . Joined: 02 Mar 2005 Posts: 1439

Dude dhex totally named it as his Game of the Year.

(In an IM. I think it still counts though.)

I just played partially through the Crysis demo. I'm going to pick it up at some point.

Winged Assassins (1984) · Posted: Fri Dec 21, 2007 1:35 am Post subject:

Cycle · Mac daddy Joined: 08 Sep 2006 Posts: 2767

haha this japanese dude in the daikatana intro is totally voiced by the guy behind LO WANG. it's the exact same voice!

right off the bat, the game is hilarious for the wrong reasons!
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Winged Assassins (1984) · Posted: Fri Dec 21, 2007 5:09 am Post subject:

Shut up, is that for reals?
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dhex · Posted: Fri Dec 21, 2007 8:24 am Post subject:

cycle, why are you trying to get me to play daikatana?

also yes stalker 2007 game of the year since i haven't played crysis. and even so, it's just so...tasty.
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Harveyjames · the meteor kid Joined: 06 Jul 2006 Posts: 3636

Shapermc · Hot Sake! Joined: 14 Oct 2004 Posts: 6279

I'm kind of hoping to get STALKER for Christmas. If I don't I heading straight to the steam store.
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“The average man has a secret desire to be a swaggering, drunken, fighting, raping swashbuckler.”
-Robert E. Howard in a letter to a friend circa Decmber 1932

"There is no place in this enterprise for a rogue physicist!"

Harveyjames · the meteor kid Joined: 06 Jul 2006 Posts: 3636

I just watched the intro to Daikatana. I think names like 'Tetsuo Ebihara' and 'Hiro Miyamoto' have got to be the western equivalent of Travis Touchdown and Dr. Peace.I mean calling someone Tetsuo Ebihara' is like being called Ron Manchester or Michael London.

dhex · Posted: Fri Dec 21, 2007 1:56 pm Post subject:

man the introduction is really...temptingly shitty.
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dhex · Posted: Fri Dec 21, 2007 2:20 pm Post subject:

or not!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6c8MC5PJj3Q&feature=related
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Scratchmonkey · . Joined: 02 Mar 2005 Posts: 1439

How many times does he say "it's not that bad"?

Shapermc · Hot Sake! Joined: 14 Oct 2004 Posts: 6279

Actually, it isn't that bad, actually it's not that bad.

This guy is kind of hilarious.
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“The average man has a secret desire to be a swaggering, drunken, fighting, raping swashbuckler.”
-Robert E. Howard in a letter to a friend circa Decmber 1932

"There is no place in this enterprise for a rogue physicist!"

Shapermc · Hot Sake! Joined: 14 Oct 2004 Posts: 6279

Actually, the trailer for it doesn't look that bad, actually.
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“The average man has a secret desire to be a swaggering, drunken, fighting, raping swashbuckler.”
-Robert E. Howard in a letter to a friend circa Decmber 1932

"There is no place in this enterprise for a rogue physicist!"

kirkjerk · . Joined: 12 Apr 2006 Posts: 1227

Harveyjames · the meteor kid Joined: 06 Jul 2006 Posts: 3636

extrabastardformula · . Joined: 08 Feb 2007 Posts: 295

Shapermc · Hot Sake! Joined: 14 Oct 2004 Posts: 6279

boojiboy7 · Posted: Fri Dec 21, 2007 6:31 pm Post subject:

I just wish stalker ran just a bit better. I am having such trouble getting into it.

Cycle · Mac daddy Joined: 08 Sep 2006 Posts: 2767

well i guess i dont have to blog the game thanks to that guy!

besides, the game is too linear, stalker would be a better LETS PLAY thing. daikatana is more like WATCH ME PLAY WITH MYSELF.
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dhex · Posted: Sat Dec 22, 2007 9:11 am Post subject:

Harveyjames · the meteor kid Joined: 06 Jul 2006 Posts: 3636

boojiboy7 · Posted: Sat Dec 22, 2007 10:43 am Post subject:

Scratchmonkey · . Joined: 02 Mar 2005 Posts: 1439

I just brought the Stalker thread back to life, do we want to do a LETS PLAY thing in there or start a new thread?

dhex · Posted: Sat Dec 22, 2007 1:00 pm Post subject:

start a new thread.
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Harveyjames · the meteor kid Joined: 06 Jul 2006 Posts: 3636

This is going to be great!

Mr. Mechanical · Friendly Stranger Joined: 14 Oct 2004 Posts: 1276

Hey Cycle are you still talking about Marathon? Because I think I am finally ready to talk about Marathon a little bit.

I'm playing the ones I got from http://source.bungie.org/get/. Quite easily the simplest and quickest I've ever managed to obtain three full length games, we're looking at approx. five minutes till I first opened the page to when I had all the games downloaded and was dinking around with the preferences getting them set up and ready to play.

I use mouselook with regular and alt fire mapped to the mouse buttons. Weapon switch mapped to the scroll wheel, typical wasd for movement, R is the action button, and Shift for walking slow. I've got the resolution as high as it'll go (1290 X 960 or somesuch), stretched to the fill the screen, NO HUD (what other way is there to play Marathon?) and so far my only complaint is that the terminal screens don't stretch to fill the entire screen and I have to lean forward a little each time I need to read one. I also changed it from 16 bit color to 32 bit.

Let's just get it out of the way right now: The game, the first one that is since that's the one I'm playing right now, looks pretty amazing for such an old game. The lighting and the way you can see into the shadows a ways before things get too dark and murky is just great. The texturing is good enough that sometimes I'll stop by a wall or doorway with some flickering light going on about it and get beside myself in how much the game almost looks like a digital painting.

It might have something to do with how I've got it set it up but the game seems to have a rather narrow field of view. The Marathon itself is rather cramped though, it being a space colony and all that I suppose it makes sense, which really goes a long way toward strengthening the atmosphere. That, combined with how creepy the music is at times, and how far apart health stations seem to be located means I've been playing as carefully as possible. So far my strategy consists of just slowly making my way through a level, finding a room with a big group of enemies, retreating back to a narrow corridor or doorway, and carefully picking them all off as they come to get me.

I don't know. With all the terminals in the game and all the time you spend reading and just exploring looking for ammo or survivors or whatever, it feels more like a science fiction adventure game fit snugly into the FPS mold. That is to say, I love looking out the windows and seeing other parts of the colony. I kind of wish it had a mini map constantly in the corner, but then that would probably makes things too easy.

Either way, best way to play Marathon: Settings cranked up, sound w/ headphones, lights out in total darkness. Sit as close to the screen as possible.
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Mr. Mechanical

Dracko · . Joined: 10 Oct 2005 Posts: 2613

If you think that looks good, wait until you get round to Durandal. It's also far more open.
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"This is the most fun I've ever had without being drenched in the blood of my enemies!"

Cycle · Mac daddy Joined: 08 Sep 2006 Posts: 2767

dhex · Posted: Mon Dec 24, 2007 5:07 pm Post subject:

after some deliberation yes i have to say stalker is game of the year. even without playing crysis, though the demo was a whole bag o' good times.

i also have to say man fuck tom clancy games. that shit is wayyyyy too involved.
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Winged Assassins (1984) · Posted: Mon Dec 24, 2007 7:22 pm Post subject:

It is Christmas so I am finishing up my Christmas playthrough of ROTT which I do every year over twelve days so you can imagine that I am sick to death of that fucking Christmas midi that plays throughout the entire game.
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boojiboy7 · Posted: Mon Dec 24, 2007 11:26 pm Post subject:

Harveyjames · the meteor kid Joined: 06 Jul 2006 Posts: 3636

My Brother-in-law got Call of Duty 4 for christmas, got to play it some more on his PS3. Man that shit is grim. The training mode was good and got us all talking and bonding in a Wii Sportsy kind of way! The game itself is :O

I will take Princess Rosalina over murdering Russian soldiers in their beds any day.

Winged Assassins (1984) · Posted: Wed Dec 26, 2007 1:29 am Post subject:

But harveyjames it is my Christmas gaming tradition. I am prepared to endure it because of this.
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bleak · . Joined: 22 Oct 2007 Posts: 258

On CoD4:

Call of Duty 4 is a very compelling game. Very powerful. I don't know whether or not it's a statement on war in general, or an analogue to current events, or what, but I enjoyed it quite a bit.
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