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dessgeega's development diary
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Worm
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 01, 2008 4:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Harveyjames wrote:
Sensitivity not a strong point for you, huh.

I was perfectly fine to leave my complaint at "not enough shooting", but you wanted to push the issue. Unless you're talking about my precision jumps here.

Most of these 2d games are so not up my alley. I'm kind of glad I missed that one really popular XNA game just because my tastes seem to diverge so heavily from what everyone loves. Hell, I even have contempt for Geowars which is a game I really play loads.
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 01, 2008 4:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mr. Mechanical wrote:
Frankly, if Jill was going to have a means of attacking the enemies I'd rather she had a whip or something like that instead of a gun.


Yes, and the whip extends all the way across the screen, but only kills with the tip, so you have to stop it by pressing the the whip button a second time.

HA HA A SEQUEL!

Or I guess that would be the Queen's play mechanic.

Wait, Dess, are you thinking what I'm thinking (what I'm thinking is gay S&M Lost Vikings, btw)?
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 01, 2008 5:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

i am now.
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 01, 2008 6:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Worm wrote:
. Hell, I even have contempt for Geowars which is a game I really play loads.


Man, I don't do anything 'loads' that I have contempt for, unless someone's paying me money.
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 01, 2008 6:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ok, well I like the game and I'm going to write about it the next issue, but I'll have to be HONEST ABOUT IT and complain about a few things since you're being compared to many other freeware games.
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 01, 2008 7:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Harveyjames wrote:
Worm wrote:
. Hell, I even have contempt for Geowars which is a game I really play loads.


Man, I don't do anything 'loads' that I have contempt for, unless someone's paying me money.

It's a scoring game and as a scoring game it's freaking excellent. However I really despise the lack of structure and that it sort of shipped as a single survival mode.

I hope that Geowars Galaxies makes it to XBLA, however as it is now some of the game really inhibits the risk taking that results in really high scores. So rather than doing awesome shit (since you're never sure when things will spawn on you) it sort of becomes a competition to see who can run it as an endurance test. Once you hit a nice stride you get a great highscore. However along the way you've got to ignore blackholes, and other things since it ultimately will fuck up your modifier.

Also, having contempt for a game like that is the only way to get good at it.
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 01, 2008 7:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

dessgeega wrote:
i am now.


WHAT THE FUCK IS THIS POSTING AT FIVE FIFTY PM NONSENSE WHY ARENT YOU ON A MOTHER FUCKING PLANE
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 01, 2008 7:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

kindly take notice that the forums time is two hours ahead.
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 02, 2008 1:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

NO SHIT BLEAK IT IS STILL PISSING ME OFF
adn now shes here
and waht teh fuck is she doing?
TAKING A GODDAMN NAP
THIS IS NONSENSE
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 02, 2008 4:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

You clods are always taking naps! Whenever I am on AIM cossix tells me Daphny is taking a nap. You're like cats

fat, lesbian cats
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 02, 2008 4:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I am so happy for the happy that everyone is so happy about.

happy happy happy

My Love Explodes!




animatronic spamboozled chocolate mushroom props to anyone who can find a link to an mp3 of that
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 02, 2008 6:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

he just says im taking a nap so i dont go OH WHO ARE YOU TALKING TO GET OFF OF THE COMPUTER MYTURNMYTURN

its acutally pretty clever
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bleak
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 02, 2008 6:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

stop taking goddamn naps
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Worm
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 02, 2008 8:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Napping is a pretty contemptible thing, especially when you're under 30.
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 02, 2008 11:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Worm wrote:
Why can't Jilloff shoot or jump on monsters?

She's a sub. Duh.
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 02, 2008 12:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

So, is this up for critique:
'cause first off I dug it a lot, and it was a perfect complement to the once-every-4-years leap day.

the pre- and post-art was kinky hot cute, but i got admit the Jill Off sprite reminds me a bit of Silent Bob's Bat outfit in Mall Rats.

I liked the use of color coding, and their rough correspondence with Save Points, I wish the mapping had been tighter (that is to say, more color changes not fewer save points).

Thinking about the control mechanism: that's directly taken from Bomb Jack, right? If it wasn't for that precedent, I would argue that "hover" rather than flap would be nice, or at least match the animation (or lack thereof!!) Conversely, maybe required repetitive finger motion is just so god damn appropriate for a game of this name, and I should relax and enjoy the physical pun. (Random self promotion: that aspect vaguely reminds me of my Java artpiece "Oh")

I had mixed feelings about some of the level design: on the one hand it seemed very well geared at guiding the player through new uses of the mechanic. On the other hand... it seemed a ltitle too geared at guiding the player through new uses of the mechanic, maybe a bit formalistic?

Still... well done, and kudos all around.
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 02, 2008 12:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

So when I heard dess was making a platformer the first thing I asked her was "how do you attack?" she said, "you don't" and I was like, "uhh, it's going to suck." But at the time there were a few things I didn't realize. Firstly, that the jump was implemented in a way that you're forced to concentrate on it so that you can learn the intricacies, and secondly, that it was 10 minutes long.

Now that I know these two things I don't really see how adding an attack mechanism (specifically a button) could improve the game. It would ruin the concentration you're spending on actually jumping and it would force the game to switch focus between platforming and shooting, since the two wouldn't neccessarily benefit each other. Also, I feel like the mechanic is explored to its full extent in the time of the game, and any more or less length would only hurt it.

That said, if she wanted the game to be longer, the only thing I can think of would be to add in new tile types and enemies. This would allow the player to explore how the base mechanic works in other situations. There could be a trampoline tile, for example, that allows/forces Jill to jump higher/faster. There could also be mobile platforms. Another option is lasers that shoot every few seconds, forcing you to time your jumps correctly. There could also be a tile that forces you to jump when you land on it. These things wouldn't neccessarily make the game better, but they would allow dess to make the game longer by letting her explore new platforming situations.

-Wes
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Adilegian
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 02, 2008 1:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Posted this over at SB, but didn't get a response, so please help anyone.

Whenever I try to load the game, I get this:



How can I fix this so the game will work?
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 02, 2008 2:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

SuperWes wrote:
So when I heard dess was making a platformer the first thing I asked her was "how do you attack?" she said, "you don't" and I was like, "uhh, it's going to suck."


The owner of a magazine that sets out to define modern game criticism, there.

Why have people got such big boners about being able to attack? Don't ever play Knytt Stories! Also like Dracko said, you're playing a submissive role when you play Jill. She's in a gimp suit for goodness sake! It's hardly subtle!


Last edited by Harveyjames on Sun Mar 02, 2008 3:18 pm; edited 1 time in total
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 02, 2008 2:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'll get behind the feeling that not every damn game needs at attack button.

On the other hand, this game is about one thing: movement. Your location, movement, and travel form entirely defines how the player interacts with the game. You could argue it's limiting, kind of like the old atari stick with its one button, but then there's always the counterpoint that sometimes crafts and arts are all about working within limitations.
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 02, 2008 3:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Unexpected error occurred when running the game. :/
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 02, 2008 3:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

kirkjerk wrote:
You could argue it's limiting, kind of like the old atari stick with its one button, but then there's always the counterpoint that sometimes crafts and arts are all about working within limitations.


Yeah, Dess always says limitations enforce creativity.

So far my favorite Dessgeega stuff have been her Knytt Stories levels. I know it's not really fair to compare one to the other, but if I did, I'd say it's much more fun to control Juni than it is Jill.
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 02, 2008 3:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Also, an attack button would be utterly useless considering you're busy trying to, you know, dodge things.
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 02, 2008 3:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Harveyjames wrote:
kirkjerk wrote:
You could argue it's limiting, kind of like the old atari stick with its one button, but then there's always the counterpoint that sometimes crafts and arts are all about working within limitations.


Yeah, Dess always says limitations enforce creativity.
I don't think force and creativity should be used within the same context.
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 02, 2008 3:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Harveyjames wrote:
SuperWes wrote:
So when I heard dess was making a platformer the first thing I asked her was "how do you attack?" she said, "you don't" and I was like, "uhh, it's going to suck."


The owner of a magazine that sets out to define modern game criticism, there.

Why have people got such big boners about being able to attack? Don't ever play Knytt Stories! Also like Dracko said, you're playing a submissive role when you play Jill. She's in a gimp suit for goodness sake! It's hardly subtle!

Fool! When I said this, my only knowledge was that it was a platformer. It's not the act of shooting that I was worried about, it's the lack of things to keep the player engaged. Dess' game makes up for this by making the jumping mechanic itself engaging. Take that out and her game would suck, but it also wouldn't be the same game so it's ok.

-Wes
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 02, 2008 4:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

bleak wrote:
Harveyjames wrote:
kirkjerk wrote:
You could argue it's limiting, kind of like the old atari stick with its one button, but then there's always the counterpoint that sometimes crafts and arts are all about working within limitations.

Yeah, Dess always says limitations enforce creativity.
I don't think force and creativity should be used within the same context.

Disagree! In this way, force = boundaries.
Sometimes, when constrained to think within the box, you get more beautiful results that you would have missed had you been creatively out of the box.
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 02, 2008 4:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

dess sure does like limiting things
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 02, 2008 4:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

KEEP IT IN THE BEDROOM
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 02, 2008 4:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

WHAT
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dessgeega
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 02, 2008 4:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Adilegian wrote:


How can I fix this so the game will work?


no clue, but that's gorgeous. now my game really does look like a nes title.
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 02, 2008 4:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ATTEMPTING TO PLAY IT WITH GAMEPAD MAKES ME SAD.
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 02, 2008 5:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

kirkjerk wrote:
Disagree! In this way, force = boundaries.
Sometimes, when constrained to think within the box, you get more beautiful results that you would have missed had you been creatively out of the box.


Warren Spector agrees, or at least he had that GDC panel a few years back (when it was in LA) about how complaining about having to work with a license as restricting your creativity is a complete cop-out.
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 02, 2008 5:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

kirkjerk wrote:
bleak wrote:
Harveyjames wrote:
kirkjerk wrote:
You could argue it's limiting, kind of like the old atari stick with its one button, but then there's always the counterpoint that sometimes crafts and arts are all about working within limitations.

Yeah, Dess always says limitations enforce creativity.
I don't think force and creativity should be used within the same context.

Disagree! In this way, force = boundaries.
Sometimes, when constrained to think within the box, you get more beautiful results that you would have missed had you been creatively out of the box.
Are you talking about the game being played itself, or the creation of the game? because I was kind of thinking of the latter.
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 02, 2008 7:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dess remember

Gothatron 5000

GODDAMMIT THIS IS COSSIX NOT DAPHNY
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 02, 2008 7:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

hey cossix, i am the jill off champ, aren't i?

also, tigsource featured this. THEY LIKE YOUR ART, JAMES
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 02, 2008 7:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

bleak wrote:
kirkjerk wrote:
bleak wrote:
Harveyjames wrote:
kirkjerk wrote:
You could argue it's limiting, kind of like the old atari stick with its one button, but then there's always the counterpoint that sometimes crafts and arts are all about working within limitations.

Yeah, Dess always says limitations enforce creativity.
I don't think force and creativity should be used within the same context.

Disagree! In this way, force = boundaries.
Sometimes, when constrained to think within the box, you get more beautiful results that you would have missed had you been creatively out of the box.
Are you talking about the game being played itself, or the creation of the game? because I was kind of thinking of the latter.

Err, the latter?

To be fair I think this game was mostly delight at finding a solution that the designer put there, I didn't get too much of a sense of "haha! this system is so flexible that I outsmarted the game writer!"
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 02, 2008 9:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Notes from my first playthrough, in order:

1. Nice art, Harveyjam!
2. I am totally digging the neat tightness of this game's aesthetic.
3. Pressing escape doesn't pause. It quits the game entirely. This is a problem as I have now lost the last ten minutes of play. I hit escape thinking it would pause the game (as it usually does) and I could check the readme to find out something. Arrgh.
4. There's no way to skip the credits at the start, I keep hitting escape which is conventional for this purpose and it quits the game. Again.
5. The first yellow section where you meet the spiders, the reload point if you die is annoyingly far back. Seriously.
6. Jill is really fun to play as.
7. I actually quit the game out of frustration at the way the save points are spaced. I'm at the screen with the boxed-in walls and the countdown and I have to keep doing that annoying jumping to get up there again. I just want to be at the final screen and I'm sick of doing that jumping again and again.

I'm really impressed as a whole by the structuring of the levels and they way they introduce you to the jumping but the whole progression is so frustrating (please please please make the death sequence shorter, if you must have one at all - clumsy fucks like me die a lot and seeing and hearing the same thing over and over again makes me want to choke someone. Just blink out and start back where you were) that I had to stop playing. Saying "You'll die a few times" is a bit of an underestimation, this game is incredibly unforgiving and if you jump a mere half-a-second too late, or miss a ledge and fall down again, it's game over because spiders are in your face and you missed your one and only chance. Which is pretty annoying after a while.
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 02, 2008 9:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

(keep pressing z to skip the intro)
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 02, 2008 9:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I see! I don't usually tend to mash keys until the credits go away though - the escape key exists as this convention for a reason.
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 02, 2008 11:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

On the indygamer blog comments someone said 'is this the most played indy game of 2008?' and someone else said 'should be, it's awesome!' True.

Oh here is the link http://www.indiegames.com/blog/2008/03/freeware_game_pick_mighty_jill.html#comments
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 03, 2008 12:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Also the Czech Republic loves us! http://plnehry.idnes.cz/arkady/mighty-jill-off.html
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 03, 2008 12:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

i beat it finally!
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 03, 2008 1:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hey Dess, so I've been wondering... what will your classmates think of this? Will anyone even notice?

Also this weekend I've been working on a platformer that has no jump button, only an attack button! Our games will fight to the death (if mine ever gets finished)!

-Wes
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 03, 2008 1:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

daphaknee wrote:
i beat it finally!


Daph I keep hanging up after a few seconds whenever I talk to you on AIM. I think I'm scared of you
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 03, 2008 2:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Harveyjames wrote:
daphaknee wrote:
i beat it finally!


Daph I keep hanging up after a few seconds whenever I talk to you on AIM. I think I'm scared of you


yeah i noticed, what the hell
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 03, 2008 3:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

There's been a lot of call for a version where the Queen and Jill take more clothes off the quicker you beat it! Also a number of people profess to be in love with The Queen! I think these characters can be called something of a success!
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 03, 2008 5:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Reviewed!

http://www.eegra.com/pages/show/title/03_03_2008_Short_Review__Mighty_Jill_Off/

Really impressed with this game. I wish I'd made it. Sad
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 03, 2008 1:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Adilegian wrote:
How can I fix this so the game will work?


quick question: what version of windows are you running?
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 03, 2008 1:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Harveyjames wrote:
There's been a lot of call for a version where the Queen and Jill take more clothes off the quicker you beat it! Also a number of people profess to be in love with The Queen! I think these characters can be called something of a success!

heheh you said beat it.

err, yeah, that is some good character design.
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Adilegian
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Joined: 28 Jul 2007
Posts: 41

PostPosted: Mon Mar 03, 2008 6:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

dessgeega wrote:
Adilegian wrote:
How can I fix this so the game will work?


quick question: what version of windows are you running?

WindowsXP, though I won't know the specs until I get home to my laptop in a few hours. I'll post what I'm running then.

Thanks!
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