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What's this? A Doctor Who thread?
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tygerbug
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 11, 2008 1:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

>> you could maybe tighten up the intro?

Yeah, no, I'm not reediting this thing again.

>> I think at one point in the intro you use the particle effects from Calvert's version, which still seem a little tacky to me. Personally, I'd consider cutting those out, since they have a direct-to-video feel to them.

I think they're fine. Though I do see what you mean.

>> Also the first time I saw the typeface in your title sequence I figured it was a placeholder... I think Williams would probably have used something a bit more elegant.

I'm pretty sure I know what he would have used - he would have drawn it himself in a style similar to what we've seen already. I actually used his font in some of the Mark 3 title sequence .... for A Richard Williams Film at least.

My own choice was intended to have an arabian nights feel to it .... I suppose it could be better, but it could also be a lot worse.

>> Also, what's the 'La la la, dete dee dee' on the very beginning of the film? Is it on any officially released version? It seems a bit like it might be a warm-up by the narrator, which they forgot to cut out for the hastily-produced rough cut.

Hastily produced??? I wouldn't call 23 years hasty!

There never WAS an officially released version of The Thief and the Cobbler. The "hastily produced rough cut" is all we have to go on.

No, it's not a warm up they forgot to cut out. What a silly thing to say.

And no, it's (probably) not the narrator's voice either. The narrator is Sir Felix Aylmer. The voice you hear is actually that of one of the brigands later in the film .... much later, you actually see that brigand and hear him doing the same bit of singing. I'm not sure if it's Sir Felix Aylmer's voice or not for that singing bit.

It's only intended to create a mood. Which it does quite well I think.
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Dracko
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 11, 2008 7:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I liked those Flash movies. It's good to actually see a properly characterised Doctor again, instead of a bumbling farce.

KinokoFry wrote:
Why, I didn't realise Moffat looked exactly like David Tennant!

EDIT: This interviewer is an idiot.


I was really blown away by it. It's a kid's movie, but it deals with some incredibly weighty issues.

Wow, good for you! Would you like to ask me some questions?

Welcome to io9.

Also, I laugh and laugh at the pretense that this kid's show somehow deals with heavy themes. It does anything but.
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tygerbug
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 11, 2008 5:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

>>It's good to actually see a properly characterised Doctor again, instead of a bumbling farce.

Aw. I like Tennant and would prefer him to Hartnell, though maybe not Troughton.
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Dracko
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 11, 2008 8:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

david tennant more like hipster yodajesus
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aderack
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 11, 2008 8:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

HEY, NOBODY HAS SHOT DRACKO'S FUCKING HEAD OFF YET!

YAY!

YOU KEEP TRUCKING, BOY.
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Dracko
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 11, 2008 9:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I shall so long as this execrable thread remains.
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aderack
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 11, 2008 11:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here's a mostly serious question. What exactly are you hoping to accomplish with the Internet fuckhead act? I mean, you're doing this deliberately. Why?
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 13, 2008 10:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

tygerbug wrote:


Hastily produced??? I wouldn't call 23 years hasty!

There never WAS an officially released version of The Thief and the Cobbler. The "hastily produced rough cut" is all we have to go on.


They'd been making footage for that long, but Williams had to edit together the rough cut in like less than a week! Also by 'officialy released', I meant The Princess and the Cobbler and Arabian Knight. BUT I THINK YOU KNEW THAT :O
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 13, 2008 10:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Also, stop trolling, Dracko.
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Dracko
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 14, 2008 9:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Fuck off. This show is a sham. Its actors are poor and their roles hardly lend themselves to much at all in the first place. This is the worst thing to be produced by the BBC, on the back of our taxes, in years - and that's saying something. No two ways about it. If that's trolling, so be it.

What next? A Sailor Moon thread? Bob the Builder? Whatever-Excuse-We-Come-Up-With-To-Piss-In-The-Mind's-Eye-Of-The-British-Public-Whilst-Raping-Them-With-A-Smile?
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 14, 2008 10:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Doctor Who has never been worse than Two Pints of Lager and a Packet of Crisps.


Edit: WELL THERE WAS THAT ONE TIME...
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Patrick Alexander
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 14, 2008 3:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dracko wrote:
What next? A Sailor Moon thread?


Why would that be a problem?
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aderack
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 14, 2008 4:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dracko, have you ever contributed anything constructive to anything, in your life?

Make a list, please.
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aderack
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 14, 2008 4:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Anyway, Torchwood is far worse.
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Dracko
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 14, 2008 5:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

aderack wrote:
Dracko, have you ever contributed anything constructive to anything, in your life?

Make a list, please.

Since when do I owe you shit? Least of all expounding upon facets of my life which are no-one's business?

Oh hey, Torchwood is a spin-off of a shit show and it is shit HOW NOVEL
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 14, 2008 10:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dracko, I'm not a Dr. Who fan myself, but I know some incredibly intelligent and wonderful people who are (and also these guys LOL), so this leads me to believe that maybe my opinion isn't the only correct one to have.
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aderack
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 15, 2008 6:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dracko wrote:
Since when do I owe you shit? Least of all expounding upon facets of my life which are no-one's business?

Since the moment you started delivering shit to my doorstep, dear.

Anyway, I'll take that as a "no".

Behave yourself or fuck off. And if you don't fuck off, I'll have a talk with dad and get you banned just because you're being a jackass. Okay?

That's not a threat. It would be a dumb threat if it were. I'm just saying, who needs this. I'm trying to be patient with you, and you keep playing this dumb game. And... I don't care. Go away, please.
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Shapermc
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 15, 2008 11:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

OK, come on now. Seriously. Dracko if you're just here to argue, please take it elsewhere.

Stop the bickering you two!
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Dracko
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 15, 2008 11:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

aderack wrote:
Dracko wrote:
Since when do I owe you shit? Least of all expounding upon facets of my life which are no-one's business?

Since the moment you started delivering shit to my doorstep, dear.

Anyway, I'll take that as a "no".

Behave yourself or fuck off. And if you don't fuck off, I'll have a talk with dad and get you banned just because you're being a jackass. Okay?

That's not a threat. It would be a dumb threat if it were. I'm just saying, who needs this. I'm trying to be patient with you, and you keep playing this dumb game. And... I don't care. Go away, please.

Take it as you will. You're still a waste of space who mistakes reasonable arguments as trolling: The last thing your shit-addled brain warrants is having anyone's life justified to you, you self-righteous cock-holster. It's not like I'm dumping Harry Potter spoilers here.

And since when was this your fucking doorstep?
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 15, 2008 4:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dracko wrote:
reasonable arguments


Dracko wrote:
your shit-addled brain


Dracko wrote:
you self-righteous cock-holster.

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 15, 2008 6:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes, my mistake, Dracko. You are a lovely person and flowers blossom out of your buttocks.

I concede victory to your reasoned argument.
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 15, 2008 8:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Shit, at least I don't take my online experience at face value to the point I demand people their life stories as vindication, you arrogant tumorous lump.

Fuck, when have you ever contributed online so damn important, since you seem to consider that essential to people's continued presence?
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 15, 2008 9:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ok, if you two want to keep this up take it else where. Seriously, this is not a place to start shit or keep it going.
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 16, 2008 9:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

So anyway, the special features on The War Machines (mentioned a few pages back) are pretty neat. Actually, the story itself -- well, let's back up a bit.

It's not my favorite Hartnell by a long shot. Yet it is a profoundly interesting story, both in terms of what's on the screen and what was going on in the background. It's one of those stories that was chopped to pieces by foreign censors, and the BBC destroyed their own prints -- so until now the best version that was available was a hodgepodge of random elements, with several holes still remaining.

For the DVD, they've cleaned things up as well as they can and used the best elements on a shot-by-shot basis, and then they've done some actually rather clever editing to fill the gaps. There's this one sequence in, I think, episode three, where nearly a full minute is missing. So they plundered every source they could think of and did a bunch of digital twiddling to fill the time. And it works! It's not perfect, yet the sound and pictures match up, and there's a certain sense of pacing. If you didn't know to watch for it, you'd probably not notice anything odd.

So there's a mini-feature on the disc, with some pretty good production values in its own right, that documents all the restoration. And it's probably the best thing on the disc.

There are some other interesting bits, that give the story context and show it to be just about as of-the-moment and poppy, by the standards of the time, as anything Russel T Davies has done. The addition of Ben and Polly is just the start of it. They had contemporary BBC newsreaders yammering of imminent danger. The story revolves around the Post Office Tower, which had only just opened a couple of weeks before broadcast, and was kind of a huge deal at the time.
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 16, 2008 12:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've never read anything about this, but the mention of the post office tower makes me curious:

How fast did classic Doctor Who go from filming -> post production -> tv? I'm imagining they didn't spend THAT much time on special effects, so - at least in those early says - was it easy to remain topical?
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 16, 2008 12:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm pretty sure the earliest Doctor Who was broadcast live, like a lot of shows in the olden days. (Otherwise they'd have edited out that bit where Ian pulls off a chunk of the styrofoam rock wall he's climbing across.)
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 16, 2008 12:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Not quite live, though they did shoot each episode in something like an hour and a half. Not including any film inserts, which were done beforehand. Then they were generally broadcast the next week.*

That's in the 1960s. Starting with Pertwee, things got a bit more modernized. The show was shot in blocks, then transmitted some while later.

The reason why they didn't edit is that videotape was really expensive, and they had to go through all sorts of hoops before they were allowed to cut it. Plus, studio time. So, basically unless they hit a real snafu, they just had to roll with what they got. Which makes the Hartnell stories particularly amazing at times, yes.

*: Often the first serial of a season was shot at the end of the previous season, though. So The Smugglers was shot at the end of season three, even though it was the first serial of season four -- which makes Tenth Planet, where Hartnell regenerated, the first thing they shot for series four. Which kind of makes a bit more sense, in that light. I often wondered why Troughton took over in the third story that year. It seemed so arbitrary.
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 16, 2008 1:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm guessing even though video tape was really expensive back then, it was still more expensive to shoot on film?

That thing where they filmed next year's first serial at the end of the previous year is interesting.
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 16, 2008 1:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Actually, tape was way more expensive than film. It was a comparably new technology. This is part of why the BBC was in the practice of wiping its tapes after broadcast, for reuse. They were considered long-term investments, while the shows contained on them were considered transitory and relatively unimportant. Every edit made the tapes harder to reuse. It's kind of amazing in retrospect, yes.

It's not really until the 1980s that videotape started to become affordable -- and that people started to associate it with cheapness, in comparison to film. A lot of the cruddy-looking interior stuff from the 1970s was at the time considered glossy and expensive, compared to the 16mm film they used for exteriors. Now, of course, it just looks ridiculous.

Oh! I guess where tape was cheaper in the long run was in its reuse. Film was just a one-shot deal, and in that sense could, I imagine, be considered more expensive.
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 17, 2008 8:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

These are altogether interesting:

http://entertainment.timesonline.co.uk/tol/arts_and_entertainment/tv_and_radio/article4759150.ece
http://entertainment.timesonline.co.uk/tol/arts_and_entertainment/tv_and_radio/article4768289.ece
http://www.sfx.co.uk/page/sfx?entry=book_review_doctor_who_the
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 20, 2008 11:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

So we'll be getting The War Machines and Four to Doomsday in January, which nearly catches us up with the R2 releases. We'll just be behind Battlefield and the R2 January release. We're even getting Trial of a Time Lord a couple of months early.

From there, looks like the January R2 release is "The E-Space Trilogy" -- three season 18 serials, that introduce Adric and write out Romana and K-9, and then serve to set up the events in The Keeper of Traken and Logopolis.

After that, there are a fair number of releases that are now more or less confirmed -- and a lot of them are from the '60s! Which is great! And the rest are mostly from the Bidmead and Cartmel eras. And even the Saward-era release contains two of the best stories to go out under him.

* The Keys of Marinus (the next unreleased season one serial; sort of a predecessor to The Chase and Daleks' Master Plan, except without the Daleks)
* The Rescue & The Romans (side-by-side stories that introduce Vicki then go on a peculiar romp in rome; referenced in "The Fires of Pompeii")
* The Chase (a Dalek story which writes out Ian and Barbara, but not before they dance to the Beatles and run from Dracula)
* The War Games (awesome incarnate; Troughton's final serial, which also writes out Jamie and Zoe, and introduces the concept of the Time Lords)
* "The Black Guardian Trilogy" (three linked Davison stories that introduce Turlough, write out Nyssa, complicate UNIT dating, and have often been vaguely referenced by the new series)
* Delta and the Bannermen (the best story from McCoy's first season)
* Cybermen Box Set - Revenge of the Cybermen / Attack of the Cybermen / Silver Nemesis

The Cyberman set surprises me for a few reasons. It only compiles three of the unreleased Cyberman stories. You'd think the Cyberman stories (even the lesser ones) would sell okay, by virtue of the iconic monster thing. And then Silver Nemesis is such an obvious candidate for a Fenric-style re-edit. It's a story that fans inexplicably beat up on all the time, yet their complaints never make much sense. Frankly, it's one of my favorite stories from the 1980s. And it's definitely one of my favorite McCoy stories.

On the subject, something interesting about the Black Guardian set is that the best of the three stories, Enlightenment, is actually to have a re-edit. It's to be chopped down for pacing, reformatted for 16:9, filmized, and regraded -- all under the watch of the original director. And this is a story without a lot of extra footage or pacing or editing problems. It's pretty great as it is. So I'm not sure what's going on there.

So that's eight slots. That leaves two more, and the most obvious candidates seem to be:

* Terror of the Autons (the introduction of the Master; needs to be recolorized with off-air NTSC elements, as with The Silurians)
* The Dæmons (the initial capture of the Master; again needs to be recolorized with off-air NTSC elements)
* Frontier In Space & Planet Of The Daleks (basically one long serial; one episode is in B&W, and would need to be colorized from scratch)
* Planet of the Spiders (Pertwee's final serial, the introduction of one of the stranger Time Lord powers, and the resolution of several story threads from the previous couple of seasons)
* The Deadly Assassin (the introduction of the modern Time Lord mythology and the first post-Delgado Master story)
* Image Of The Fendahl (a forgettable Tom Baker serial)
* The Twin Dilemma (Colin Baker's regrettable first serial -- and only remaining one, after Trial and Attack)

The reasoning for all of these is that commentaries have been recorded. Some of them (as with Autons and Dæmons) were recorded eons ago. Some, more recently. Steve Roberts hints that there's a decent share of Pertwee next year. If there are only two slots left, that would seem to either imply two Pertwee slots or one larger and more significant Pertwee slot.

Of the above serials, the ones that strike me as the most likely in the short term are Autons, Spiders, and the two Tom Baker stories. We'll see, though. I think it's fair to assume we won't see Twin Dilemma next year.

Something to note: the Cyberman simultaneously completes seasons 12 (Tom's first) and 22 (Colin's first). And this is just shortly after Battlefield, which completes 26 (McCoy's last). And the E-Space set puts 18 (Tom's last) one release away from completion, and the Black Guardian set puts seasons 19 and 20 (Davison's first two) a collective two releases away from completion.

So are we finally on the way toward season sets, then?
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 25, 2008 9:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

On Roobarb's, steverobertsbbc wrote:
Gosh, what could this be that has just appeared at the BBFC?

01:34:55:22 DOCTOR WHO - BATTLEFIELD
00:01:31:08 DOCTOR WHO (SEASON 26 TRAILER)

So. Season sets aweigh. Starting at the end.

Ironic thing here is, this is one of only two seasons that I've been collecting in individual releases. So as much as I'd love a season set of it, it's, uh... well.

I wonder if it'll have any extra features over the indies?
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 25, 2008 11:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Okay. On OG,

Pretty Reliable Guy #1 wrote:
I'm reliably told that the series is tied up 'til series 9. No possible hiatus 'til then... That ties in very well with what I heard of Moff's 5-year contract.

Pretty Reliable Guy #2 wrote:
Patrick Stewart has been formally approached to play a "significant role" in Doctor Who.

* There will be no facial prosthetics or heavy make up.
* There's a "killer" costume.
* Patrick is keen to play someone who is "not the good guy for a change" (although the character is "not all bad").
* It's a significant enough character to be either moved, removed, or revived later, depending on his availability.
* He's keen to work again with David Tennant and "have the relationship evolve".

Pretty Reliable Guy #3 wrote:
[in response to someone suggesting the Monk for Stewart] We have a winner!!!

And while I'm at it... Here are some words to smile at...

* A Moff-written Dalek TWO-PARTER to open the season...
* Celtic companion. Non-contemporary.
* Ice Warriors
* Zygons

Good dawgs...

Oh yeah. Gaiman is still on the cards. He's been asked to prepare two different ideas according to my dawg... And Paul Cornell is likely too...

Pretty Reliable Guy #2 again wrote:
I think what's happened is that the Moff has very recently presented a preliminary "bible" to the the BBC, with some, if not all, of the bits and pieces that have come out tonight on it.

The Series 5 stuff I would imagine is subject to change, but it is the initial outline for the next full series, with a two-part opener and a very insidious and, in my opinion, excellent, arc culminating in the finale.

The plan at the moment is that the series is coming back with a two part Dalek story. As far as I know they won't appear in the series again that year, however, the enemy who will reveal themselves in the series denouement will have been in every episode of series 5.

[Regarding the "Celtic" companion] Similarly to Donna, there will be no "romantic" involvement with the Doctor.

And I'll confirm the Gaiman and Cornell thing too.

Pretty Reliable Guy #3 again wrote:
I understand people's surprise at the veritable golden shower of new info this evening, but as Eddie pointed out earlier, this is all due to the Moff just delivering his 'Season 5 plans' to various people for consideration, feedback, planning, etc... It's the nature of the beast; you get nothing, spoiler-wise, for ages, and then a TARDISload all at once.

Everyone is confirming everyone else, so either there's a big practical joke going on amongst all the people who regularly are pretty on-target... or there's a bunch of deliberate misinformation going around... or!

Anyway. To sum:

Supposedly Moffat has just circulated a big memo-thing to relevant parties, detailing his plans for series five.

* Patrick Stewart as the Monk. Possibly recurring.
* Series starts with a (Moffat-written) Dalek two-parter. The Daleks will not reappear, after that. Probably.
* Also, Gaiman and Cornell, still probably.
* Zygons
* Ice Warriors
* The "Big Bad" will have been in every episode, somehow or other
* New, non-contemporary, "Celtic" companion. No romantic element.
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 27, 2008 8:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

aderack wrote:
* The "Big Bad" will have been in every episode, somehow or other


I find this the most interesting. Though, hell, there's a lot in there that sounds pretty intriguing.
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 27, 2008 10:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah, I'm not sure what this might mean. I doubt it's got to do with the companion, as after I posted that, one of the above parties said the idea was for the companion to stay for series six, depending on what happened in the "Doctor-lite" episode. Not sure what that's supposed to mean either, but it's such a strange thing to say that it has the air of plausibility to it.
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aderack
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 29, 2008 2:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, the first of the two SJA episodes today is pretty great. Just now began to download the second.

It manages to wrap several things together quite well. Maria's getting written out, reuse of costumes and effect footage from Doctor Who, setting up a sort of arc for the series, referencing and building off new and old continuity, without being beholden to it. And i like Phil Ford's authorial voice. A heck of a lot more than Gareth Roberts.

This is a lot more confident than the first series. And so far, this is looking like the best story to date, save Whatever Happened to Sarah Jane?. Which, going by The Writer's Tale, Davies heavily rewrote. And honestly, it feels way more like his voice than Roberts'.

Curiously, one of Ford's stories last year heavily referenced the Sontarans.

Oh, I must say the production is at times ridiculous. I don't know who did the graphics and design for the radio telescope... or what he thought he was doing.
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Patrick Alexander
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 29, 2008 4:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Maria's getting written out? What the hell; why?
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aderack
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 29, 2008 5:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The actress had to pay attention to school. GSCEs, or whatever those things are.

Now seen the second part. They handled it really well. It's weird that she's going, since she's effectively the main character. It sounds like they're leaving the door wide open for her to come back when she's done studying, though.
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Dracko
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 15, 2008 9:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

aderack wrote:
The actress had to pay attention to school. GSCEs, or whatever those things are.

Hahahahahahahahaha!

Oh wait, I'm sorry. I shouldn't laugh at the mentally incontinent.

Not that any of the new cast getting written out is a great loss by any means.

Anyway:

IDW is currently republishing all of Grant Morrison's Doctor Who work he did under the Marvel UK label.
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aderack
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 15, 2008 10:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

What the fuck is your problem? Are you making fun of my not having gone through the British school system? What point are you trying to make here?

Yeah, not too fond of Grant Morrison's Who work. It's kind of... there. The Parkhouse stuff is pretty good. Scott Gray's stuff in the '90s is fantastic. Morrison's work kind of fills up space.
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Dracko
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 16, 2008 2:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

No, I'm making fun of the fact that an actress feels the need to take a break to essentially go through the academic equivalent of tying one's shoelaces.

Loosen the fuck up.
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baronpatsy
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 01, 2008 7:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

So. Tennant's leaving after the specials.

And the version of Davros's theme on the Series 4 OST is kind of disappointing. They added all kinds of silly whooshing noises behind the little electronic plinks at the beginning.
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Westacular
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 01, 2008 10:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Oh! The Series 4 soundtrack is out. Just the other day I was thinking, 'tis the season, but I hadn't checked yet.
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JamesE
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 04, 2009 4:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

aderack wrote:
Dracko wrote:
Since when do I owe you shit? Least of all expounding upon facets of my life which are no-one's business?

Since the moment you started delivering shit to my doorstep, dear.

Anyway, I'll take that as a "no".

Behave yourself or fuck off. And if you don't fuck off, I'll have a talk with dad and get you banned just because you're being a jackass. Okay?

That's not a threat. It would be a dumb threat if it were. I'm just saying, who needs this. I'm trying to be patient with you, and you keep playing this dumb game. And... I don't care. Go away, please.


Bumping thread to call you a childish cunt

Good e-work, Dracko

Anticipating a superior Dr Who now the guy who can write lovely humanist tales is in the saddle rather than the wart-faced kitsch machine and the metrosexual gonk is retiring
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