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help w/ desktops and laptops

 
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Redeye
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 27, 2008 9:13 am    Post subject: Re: help w/ desktops and laptops Reply with quote

kirkjerk wrote:


...

but it's weirdly slow now, like 5 minutes from power on 'til Firefox


Check the startup file. Remove anything that doesn't have to be there.
Perhaps get a faster HD/flash drive for it to boot from.

Quote:
So, the PC...

I got a decent UPS, and the problem still recurs, so I've isolated one variable.

The powerdown seems pretty random, and uncorrelated to how busy the system seems. It MIGHT seem a little more like in the first 5 or 10 minutes (which might mean it is correlated to behind-the-scenes busyness a bit, but still, last few times it didn't seem to be HD thrashing or anything) But it seems like if its been going for a while, it probably won't shut off, except maybe in a long while.

So any advice for diagnosing/fixing that?[/url]


By UPS do you mean Uninterruptible Power Supply?

That's not your problem. It's almost certainly the regular power supply.

I've lost 2 computers to shitty power supplies. They fry the mobos, and can damage other stuff.

Don't get a cheap one, and don't get an expensive one.

Get one more powerful than you need for over $30 and less than $50.

I could be wrong, but this seems like a PS issue.

Could be a cooling issue, the computer shutting off from overheating, but I can't see that happening in the first 5-10 minutes unless you got a loose heat sink/broken fan.
Even then, I don't think it would happen so fast. Unless a broken sensor is detecting an overheat that isn't there and shutting off pre-emptively.
No, that's just too much imagination.

My gut says replace the power supply.
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 27, 2008 9:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

sounds like a psu unless some fan is broken.
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 27, 2008 9:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah, you're right. And before I get all excited about a MacMini running XP I probably should consider just seeing what kind of PSU this thing has and updating it.
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 28, 2008 7:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

So it's gotten slightly worse, not in the sense of happening more often (for a brief time I had hopes that making sure all the external cables were well seated it was over the problem) but it seems to be having more trouble restarting; after its off it has a blue light that's on, but no fan, simple switching the power doesn't help, at first I thought holding in to do a "full shutdown" and reboot was the ticket, this last time, I dunno, maybe it was the same, but not quite.

So, probably PSU or switch? Or?

(heh or excuse to get Mac mini)
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 28, 2008 9:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

kirkjerk wrote:
So it's gotten slightly worse, not in the sense of happening more often (for a brief time I had hopes that making sure all the external cables were well seated it was over the problem) but it seems to be having more trouble restarting; after its off it has a blue light that's on, but no fan, simple switching the power doesn't help, at first I thought holding in to do a "full shutdown" and reboot was the ticket, this last time, I dunno, maybe it was the same, but not quite.

So, probably PSU or switch? Or?

(heh or excuse to get Mac mini)


PSU or switch.

PSU is most likely, because the switch being broken would probably not be causing it to power down spontaneously, just making it hard to power up.

You can always just hook up the HD to your laptop. Maybe. Might need extra cables and stuff.
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 29, 2008 9:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

So this is what my slimline looks like on the inside:


It's been kind of a long time since I've cracked a PC, and lately I've been favoring these kind of odd ball small designs. So: the plastic thing w/ the cooling fan comes out. The PSU at top has 3 removable screws, and slides around, but is kind of stuck in place w/ wires and what not.

Anyway, can you tell from this photo is that a fairly normal, replaceable PSU, or is it some weird oddball HP mini thing? (For scale, I think that's a normal DVD burner mounted sideways underneath it)
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 29, 2008 10:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Redeye wrote:
You can always just hook up the HD to your laptop. Maybe. Might need extra cables and stuff.

At this point I'm able to get all the files I need off of the PC... in fact two days ago I made a full backup of my "C:\data\" directory (which is where I keep all my stuff for just such an easy back up. ) onto a USB HD .

My Perl scripts to do the backup did plenty of disk thrashing, both the HD and the external USB HD, and not a single power glitch, so there doesn't seem to a correlation with that kind of load. (Dunno about the processor, but nothing jumps out at me there either.)
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 29, 2008 10:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

i don't know if hp does the nonstandard thing or if you can slap a psu in there - you may wish to call them or check out the website for your particular model number.
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 29, 2008 12:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

here's one forum talking about it

Gah, I dunno. It seems like there's some precedent for generic "slimline PSUs" but it seems like a gamble.. if I had trouble getting it to fit or work, I may not know for sure if it was something I was being dumb about or it was just the wrong model.

There's a Micro Center nearby, that might have both the part and maybe I could even pay for them to install it, but in the latter case I should probably wipe the pr0n etc.

So my options are,
A. get a PSU, try my luck, maybe enlist a semi-smart buddy
B. get a PSU, clear the drive, let someone else try their luck
C. say screw it and shell out for the Mac Mini, and likely a copy of XP.
D. I could comibne C+B; xfer the drive contents to a new PC, which makes me feel better about clearing it and then handing off the computer.
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 01, 2008 9:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

FWIW, I'm trying A, except I ordered the HP specific PSU online... I'll let you know how it goes...
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 02, 2008 3:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's hard to tell since the power problem was always intermitent, but running this PC w/ the cover off all day it hasn't recurred. Could it be a heat thing?
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 02, 2008 3:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

maybe? is one of your case fans dead?
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 17, 2008 8:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

eh, they seemed fine to me
I've been running it for a few weeks w/o a power glitch, w/ the case off

i just reattached the faceplate, we'll see if it makes a difference.

after that i'll try putting the cover back on, just on the off chance it's something that my fiddling magically fixed
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 05, 2008 8:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

So, the mysterious power shutdowns haven't been repeating.

But now I need your opinion.

I decided the Averatec, w/ it's non-battery and ever-flakier power connecction (despite being resoldered once by my Uncle) was ready for retirement. So I was going to retry my strategy of the cheapest new laptop (w/ WiFi + DVD) I could buy.

I ended up with a $550 Acer Aspire (Ugh, what an irritating goading naming. Why couldn't they just call it the "GOOD START CHEAPSKATE 3000"?) I usually aim small for laptops, but it turns out the current "small without paying for it to be small" is now pretty big!

The specs include AMD Turion 64 x2 Mobile, NVidda Geforece 7000M, 2GB DDR, 15.4" screen, 120 Gb drive, DVD DL w/ burner

So far my biggest concern is... da dah.... Vista. XP would have been my first choice. I was a little nervous about vista, and the first screen after log-in was not reassuring.

So many little fiddly bits and doodahs and messages and oversized icons and shiny crap over a tacky background (ok that last one was maybe a little my fault)... it's like a digital clown exploded.

But I managed to dial down the UI to what I'm familiar with. I'm really in the "OS shouldn't matter" camp; the whole laptop is just a web-browser and DVD player for me, so I might it look like a Win-95 variant (with a weird habit of putting my task bar on the right side, especially w/ the new 16:9 screens)

ANYWAY... should I look to downupgrade to XP? Vista isn't bugging me that much, the performance seems... eh, not bad. This ain't a gaming rig, save for casual downloads. So I dunno.
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 06, 2008 12:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

XP

Vista will eventually pull some shit in a situation where you can't do anything about it.

Especially if, since it is a laptop, you are moving around with it.

Like if you try watching a DVD with region or format problems.

The uber-paranoid DRM crap might lock you up.

It also might not like you using any non-Windows-Soul-Contract programs.

XP.

Or linux.

I wish there was an Amiga laptop.
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 06, 2008 7:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Redeye wrote:

XP.

Or linux.

I wish there was an Amiga laptop.

Heh.

One thing is, is garden variety XP pretty good about device discovery etc on laptops? DVD / WiFi / Graphics Card / Memory Card Reader / Trackpad?

(And how much better is the performance, if I dial away all the Vista shiny crap?)

Things that keep in Windows clutches:
vs Linux:
* this might be unfair against Linux, but on my Linux desktop at work (admittedly an older version of Red Hat w/ some Gnome X stuff) I can't right click on an image in Firefox and copy it to clipboard. Do other versions of Linux handle this? The fact that sometimes Linux by default doesn't just reeks.... I mean I think Windows 3.1 got THAT right...

vs OSX:
* ok, philosophically the Dock, with its mixing of programs now running and program launching shortcuts makes less sense to me than the taskbar. (Yes, I know on every platform there are tools to make it run like another platform, but I'd like to avoid that kind of structure)
* err, expensive hardware

vs Both
* it seems like support for all those weird ass flash-based and otherwise movie formats is weaker on other platforms
* my fingers are kind of tuned to Windows shortcuts now
* default software; irfanview which is always a keystroke away from fullscreen mode, rotate, go to next, etc, Textpad, and it amazes me that so few text editors have easy macros, Gimp's "hardcore geek, assume nothing" UI really annoys me, and I'm too cheap for Photoshop, so I end up sticking with this ancient vs of Paint Shop Pro and Animation Shop.

So, I say my philosophy is "OS doesn't matter" but really it's more like "if you're thinking about the OS, you're losing" and for me XP is the OS I don't have to think about, because of how I can dial its fisher price look away and look like computers have looked for me since late '95.
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 06, 2008 2:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you dial away the Vista shiny crap it'll work fine. Possibly a little slower, but it does apparently pay you back for the extra second or 3 here and there with various sorts of betterness.

Turning off file indexing to stop contant HD access will help with battery life.

As far as XP compatibility/finding devices/wifi: XP has had a really long time to build up libraries for this stuff.

I can only see a problem if newer stuff is deliberately gimped to induce people to switch from xp to Vista.
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 06, 2008 8:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Oy, should I be worried about intermittent futziness w/ the touchpad? sometimes it seems a little slow to respond, other time it seems to be getting bogus scritchiness and clicks, up and to the left of where the cursor is...
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 07, 2008 8:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

touchpads have been known to get odd, so maybe not panic but keep an eye on it to be sure.

also i vote for xp as well if you're staying windows.
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 11, 2008 1:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The kind of Acer laptops I seem to like the looks of sell out fast, so I'm simply asking about a single facet.

I like the looks of this thing. I want something light, resistant, but still capable, essentially. So I'm wondering whether the Intel's GMA video cards are competent stuff?
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 11, 2008 2:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dracko wrote:
The kind of Acer laptops I seem to like the looks of sell out fast, so I'm simply asking about a single facet.

I like the looks of this thing. I want something light, resistant, but still capable, essentially. So I'm wondering whether the Intel's GMA video cards are competent stuff?


I did some checking around, and it seems as though the integrated card is good for movies, typical Internet Stuff (checking email, youtube clips, etc.), but, as you might expect, it won't run the newest games that well. I have an old Radeon X300 Mobile and it can handle some games - Guild Wars came out after I bought it and looked pretty good - and older stuff runs fine, so I would say that even for PC games you wouldn't be too bad. If there is too much detail, like in a Total War game, or a newer first-person shooter you would have problems. Acer's systems are kind of spotty - my father has an Acer laptop for work that is pretty wonky - but if you like the brand and don't mind limiting your PC games to around 2006, you should be good.
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 11, 2008 3:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

By Total War game, I suppose you mean the most recent ones? I have Shogun and Medieval. Don't know if Rome is worth it. It may be!

But yeah, sounds good. If I can run Half-LifeČ and maybe Team Fortress 2, it sounds ideal to me.
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 11, 2008 6:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Half-Life 2 can scale pretty well, if I recall correctly. I was trying to play Rome: Total War - Barbarian Invasion. I had everything set to minimal and it was painful. The world map scrolled slowly but the battles chugged along so badly that I gave up.

You know, I have HL2 on Steam, I'm going to go try it on my laptop and see how it is. If it works well on it, then you should have no problems.
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 11, 2008 9:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, Half-Life 2 ran, but I had to turn a lot of the bells and whistles down or off. It looked similar to the original running on a TNT2. I think it would look and run much better on yours though. The performance was much better than the Rome expansion and it's very scalable.
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 11, 2008 10:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for checking it out!

I'll probably invest in this one, then.
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 11, 2008 10:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Not a problem!

Some other games I've tried on it that ran well: Battlefield 2, Neverwinter Nights, and Warcraft 3. The Guild 2, which uses some weird engine a lot of pretty European games use, performed too poorly to continue playing. Those are the newest games I've ran on it - it's from 2004, which in laptop years means it might as well have been made in 1987.

I tend to use it for older stuff - Diablo 2, Fallout, Icewind Dale 2 - and work whenever I'm out and about. So yeah, I think you would find anything 2006 and prior, as well as a handful of newer titles, should run fine with the graphics set to medium to high settings.
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