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JamesE
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Joined: 27 Nov 2006
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 Posted: Sun Dec 03, 2006 3:20 am Post subject: SVP: The upgrade program that never was |
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Two little snippets of 1994 from SEGA-releated fan sites:
http://www.theghz.com/sonic/son3/son3.html#behind
| Quote: | | In the early 90's, Nintendo partnered with Argonaut Software to develop the Super FX chip, a 3D graphics processor that could be implemented in Super Famicom games on a cart-by-cart basis, allowing the hardware to draw a limited number of polygons for simple 3D graphics. Not to be outdone, Sega responded by licensing SuperH microprocessor technology from Hitachi, and made plans to implement the SH-1 chip in select Mega Drive cartridges under the pseudonym "Sega Virtua Processor" (SVP). Sonic Team was initially very interested in this new technology and planned to make full use of the SVP chip for Sonic 3. Sega, however, wanted the new Sonic game out before work on the SVP chip could be completed, so the original designs were scrapped in favor of another 2D Sonic game. (In the end, Virtua Racing became the only SVP game released.) |
http://www.sega-16.com/Segas%20SVP%20Chip-%20the%20Road%20not%20Taken.php
| Quote: | | The only real problem was that the chip's inclusion practically doubled the price of the game, since it was so expensive to produce. To get around this problem, Sega planned to sell the SVP in a separate cartridge that would work in the same fashion as Galoob's Game Genie. This way, gamers would only have to purchase the technology once. However, Sega canned the project for unknown reasons and instead chose to focus its efforts on more powerful hardware — namely the 32X. Thus the SVP chip died a quick death, leaving the technology's untapped potential to fade with time. |
Interesting stuff. While deck extenders have a pretty unproven history (some possibky unreleased Codemasters stuff on the Aladdin deck expander for NES, I think?) it would have done less to blow fist-sized holes in Sega's reputation. The possibility of 3D Sonic in 1994 is pretty interesting stuff to dwell on - Mario 64's place in history could have been displaced, leading to some sort of butterfly effect that would leave us in a very different place from where we are now. Of course, it could have been awful and put Sonic in the gutter 12 years earlier.
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km
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Joined: 25 Nov 2006
Posts: 16
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| Posted: Sun Dec 03, 2006 3:36 am Post subject: |
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Huh!
So, did Hitachi make the SH series processors specifically for SEGA? Or were they just buddy-buddy?
The Genesis with the SH-1, the 32x and Saturn with the SH-2, and the DC with the SH-4?
Have those processors made it into anything else?
EDIT: Wikipedia of course has the answer:
It looks like the SH-4 was made specifically for the Dreamcast. The others... are all over the place. Hm.
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JamesE
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Joined: 27 Nov 2006
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| Posted: Sun Dec 03, 2006 3:53 am Post subject: |
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I can vividly remember some Sony PR dude being interviewed in 1995 and landing a stone-cold diss on Sega by claiming the Saturn used chips found in "vacuum cleaners and washing machines". Score one for the Sony PR machine.
This was back when people thought Sony needed a Sonic-Killer to win the console wars. Heh.
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extralife
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Joined: 22 Jun 2005
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| Posted: Sun Dec 03, 2006 4:54 am Post subject: |
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That all sounds like just about the worst thing ever.
These "3D chips" were unnecessary and a little condescending anyway; imagine if Starfox had costed a hundred dollars, or required an add-on? Terrible. Now, imagine that Starfox just cost the regular 'ol fifty bucks, but Sega's half-hearted clone cost a hundred! Something tells me that wouldn't have helped Sega's reputation in the end.
Also, I'm pretty sure that a chipped Sonic 3 would've resembled Donkey Kong Country more than Mario 64. Either that, or it'd relegate 3d duty entirely to the special stages. |
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Takashi
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Joined: 27 Nov 2006
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| Posted: Sun Dec 03, 2006 10:21 am Post subject: |
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| Considering the lack of direction that was in making a 3D Sonic for the following 5 years, I highly doubt the SVP would have produced a genre-breaking Sonic 3. |
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player 2
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Joined: 10 Jul 2005
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Location: Madison, WI USA
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| Posted: Sun Dec 03, 2006 10:52 am Post subject: |
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| Takashi wrote: | | Considering the lack of direction that was in making a 3D Sonic for the following 5 years, I highly doubt the SVP would have produced a genre-breaking Sonic 3. |
On the 16 bit Genesis, no less.
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Maz
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Joined: 26 Nov 2006
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| Posted: Sun Dec 03, 2006 11:37 am Post subject: |
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| Takashi wrote: | | Considering the lack of direction that was in making a 3D Sonic for the following 5 years, I highly doubt the SVP would have produced a genre-breaking Sonic 3. |
Most of the staff that made Sonic successful would still have been at Sonic Team at the time. The 3D games were created without 2 of the staff who really masterminded the 2D games.
It would be interesting to see how 3D platformers would have developed without Mario 64 as the archetype. |
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GcDiaz
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Joined: 25 Sep 2006
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| Posted: Sun Dec 03, 2006 1:31 pm Post subject: |
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Crash Bandicoot. Vertical/Horizontal scrolling platformer. Mario64 really was a giant leap of imagination.
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Takashi
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| Posted: Sun Dec 03, 2006 1:35 pm Post subject: |
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| Maz wrote: | | It would be interesting to see how 3D platformers would have developed without Mario 64 as the archetype. |
That I agree (especially what would have replaced the "hub"). I highly doubt, however, Sonic 3 was to be a fully 3D game. |
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JamesE
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Joined: 27 Nov 2006
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| Posted: Sun Dec 03, 2006 2:46 pm Post subject: |
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| extralife wrote: | That all sounds like just about the worst thing ever.
These "3D chips" were unnecessary and a little condescending anyway; imagine if Starfox had costed a hundred dollars, or required an add-on? Terrible. Now, imagine that Starfox just cost the regular 'ol fifty bucks, but Sega's half-hearted clone cost a hundred! Something tells me that wouldn't have helped Sega's reputation in the end.
Also, I'm pretty sure that a chipped Sonic 3 would've resembled Donkey Kong Country more than Mario 64. Either that, or it'd relegate 3d duty entirely to the special stages. |
I'm not really sure how extra cartridge hardware is condescending given that the SNES was intended to use such hardwaret from the ground up and the NES had been using custom Mappers to boost itself for years. I'm also not sure what kind of halfhearted clone Sega ever made of Starfox. I certainly know I'd have been interested to splash out a few more monies on a passthrough to play awesome AM2 arcade games in my house in 1994 rather than an extra 20-40 a game.
Sonic 3(d) would have been designed from the ground up by Yasuhara and programmed by Yuji Naka before he took leave of giving a fuck so I would have been pretty interested to see it.
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Winged Assassins (1984)
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Joined: 28 Nov 2006
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Location: Super Magic Drive
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| Posted: Sun Dec 03, 2006 3:18 pm Post subject: |
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| GcDiaz wrote: | | Crash Bandicoot. Vertical/Horizontal scrolling platformer. Mario64 really was a giant leap of imagination. |
They probably would have been like Bug! first.
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B coma
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Joined: 06 Dec 2005
Posts: 279
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| Posted: Sun Dec 03, 2006 4:31 pm Post subject: |
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This thread made me think about this 3D helicopter game EA released for Genesis that I somehow got my hands on as a kid (I can't remember the name?). I don't know if it had a custom chip or not but the game was as slow as molasses, locked in at about 5 fps.
It didn't stop me from playing it for hours on end though, running into a target in the desert about once every 10 minutes.
I conjecture that this hypothetical Sonic 3 would have resembled the Knuckles Chaotix bonus game with actual scenery, or some kind of protoplasmic Sonic Xtreme. |
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GcDiaz
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Joined: 25 Sep 2006
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Location: Clinton, MA
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| Posted: Sun Dec 03, 2006 6:01 pm Post subject: |
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| B coma wrote: | This thread made me think about this 3D helicopter game EA released for Genesis that I somehow got my hands on as a kid (I can't remember the name?). I don't know if it had a custom chip or not but the game was as slow as molasses, locked in at about 5 fps.
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LHX Attack Helicopter. Played the hell out of it on a 286 IBM, and the framerate wasn't much better. Funny how it featured the Osprey nearly a decade before its debut.
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B coma
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Joined: 06 Dec 2005
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| Posted: Sun Dec 03, 2006 6:06 pm Post subject: |
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that's the one!
I should give it a whirl in emulation soon. |
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Winged Assassins (1984)
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| Posted: Sun Dec 03, 2006 6:12 pm Post subject: |
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Play M1 Abrams instead, it's cooler.
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GcDiaz
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| Posted: Sun Dec 03, 2006 7:01 pm Post subject: |
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Retaliator, dammit. If someone could help me run it in DosBox under win95 compatibility mode I'd love you forever.
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B coma
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Joined: 06 Dec 2005
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| Posted: Sun Dec 03, 2006 7:05 pm Post subject: |
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| Winged Assassins (1984) wrote: | | Play M1 Abrams instead, it's cooler. |
also for Genesis?
I'll keep it in mind. I still want to check out LHX though. It's been so long I that I imagine playing it again will result in the hilarious clash of reality vs. mostly forgotten memories. |
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shnozlak
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Joined: 05 Jul 2005
Posts: 33
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| Posted: Sun Dec 03, 2006 7:22 pm Post subject: |
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| B coma wrote: | | Winged Assassins (1984) wrote: | | Play M1 Abrams instead, it's cooler. |
also for Genesis?
I'll keep it in mind. I still want to check out LHX though. It's been so long I that I imagine playing it again will result in the hilarious clash of reality vs. mostly forgotten memories. |
I got that game in a box-o-genesis that I bought off a kid back in highschool. Its very terrible.
Man, if only sega had put this chip in the sega cd and not brought the sega CD out so soon. The system cost could be easily off set by the cheap to print and impressive games it would be able to produce.
heres an intresting quote from the sega CD wiki:
"The Mega-CD also features sprite enhancement effects such as scaling and rotation, similar to that of the Super Famicom/SNES Mode 7. However Sega refused to allow developers access to the software required to take advantage of these features, partially leading to the system's downfall."
Why sega? Why?
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OtakupunkX
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Joined: 23 Mar 2006
Posts: 730
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| Posted: Mon Dec 04, 2006 10:01 am Post subject: |
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| shnozlak wrote: | heres an intresting quote from the sega CD wiki:
"The Mega-CD also features sprite enhancement effects such as scaling and rotation, similar to that of the Super Famicom/SNES Mode 7. However Sega refused to allow developers access to the software required to take advantage of these features, partially leading to the system's downfall."
Why sega? Why? |
DON'T TRUST WIKIPEDIA. /end ridiculous paranoia.
Also, I find it really interesting that the regular Genesis verson of Virtua Racing cost $100 but the same game was about $70 less on both the 32X (if it did come out on the 32X and I'm not thinking about another game) and the Saturn.
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