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chompers po pable
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Joined: 10 Nov 2005
Posts: 142
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 Posted: Fri Dec 01, 2006 2:26 pm Post subject: |
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the game wouldn't let me beat it! ergo it sucks!
(i kid, dmauro. kind of) |
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dmauro
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Joined: 20 Jul 2006
Posts: 303
Location: Brooklyn
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| Posted: Fri Dec 01, 2006 2:34 pm Post subject: |
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but that's really how I feel 
I hate when games cheat me. I don't mind a hard game, but I don't want to be cheated. |
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dessgeega
loves your favorite videogame
Joined: 16 Jun 2005
Posts: 6563
Location: bohan
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| Posted: Fri Dec 01, 2006 2:41 pm Post subject: |
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the final battle is glitchy and not entirely fair.
it's conceptually wonderful. but the implementation isn't quite perfect.
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dongle
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Joined: 25 Nov 2006
Posts: 290
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| Posted: Fri Dec 01, 2006 2:42 pm Post subject: |
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| I'm surprised there hasn't been much talk of the horses. SotC's horse animations and interface were amazing, if not user friendly. |
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internisus
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Joined: 25 Nov 2006
Posts: 354
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| Posted: Fri Dec 01, 2006 2:58 pm Post subject: |
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| zebadayus wrote: | | No no no, it's not about the fact that you disagree or are slightly outraged with the way he's playing the game. It's that you're all "Oh god oh my god please make it stop" instead of just straightforward explaining that you think that he's missing out on what you feel is half of what makes the game so enjoyable. |
I realize that this issue is dead by this point, but I do think I should apologize for the poorly chosen expression "Oh god oh my god please make it stop." I would have done better to explain, however obvious it seemed to me, the objective fact that a guide-assisted playthrough of such an artful and wonderful game decimates its most fundamental strengths. I am not interested in arguments about guides saving you time (who is rushing you? spend the next two years with the game if you need to.). The player has every right to ruin his own experience, but doing so invalidates his subsequent opinion on that experience. If you destroy the game's power, you should not expect it to be a powerful experience. Would you be surprised if someone felt shocked or dismayed were you to tell them that you have been reading cliffnotes chapters prior to each chapter of a great piece of literature? It is not different at all.
Again, I apologize for my initial in-jokey IC-like mannerism, but I stand by the point and maintain that the practice in question is objectively evil. |
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Mister Toups
Hates your favorite videogame
Joined: 26 Jan 2005
Posts: 1693
Location: Lafayette, LA
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| Posted: Fri Dec 01, 2006 3:01 pm Post subject: |
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guardian I just realized you have posted 135 times since registering on Sunday.
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internisus
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Joined: 25 Nov 2006
Posts: 354
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| Posted: Fri Dec 01, 2006 3:11 pm Post subject: |
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| That's a very interesting I mean completely irrelevant and asinine observation, Toups. I sense you meant to jab me in the ribs, yet, sadly, you have missed and fallen on your face. Don't make me waste the thread's time again. |
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Nana Komatsu
weak sauce
Joined: 17 Jul 2006
Posts: 1293
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| Posted: Fri Dec 01, 2006 3:25 pm Post subject: |
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| Toups your title changed. Change it back. |
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Mr Mustache
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Joined: 26 Oct 2006
Posts: 167
Location: Queens
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| Posted: Fri Dec 01, 2006 3:57 pm Post subject: |
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Guardian, despite your strong feelings about the game's merit, if Shadow of the Colossus, or any other work of art, fails on a fundamental level to engage the viewer, the blame for this failure lies (for the most part) with the work in question, not the spectator (participator?).
Additionally, a great many people have jobs and (unbelievably) other interests. Games can simply take far too much time, and while this may be enjoyable to some, it is entirely understandable that one would choose to forgo "exploring the landscape...only roughly directed by the sword's light" in favor of a more efficient experience.
I mean, I know where you're coming from. I only watch movies with the subtitles, and would probably enjoy Beyond Good and Evil more, if this option existed. However the idea that there is one true way to experience a creator's pure vision, is a bit absurd.
Also, play Marathon.
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Mister Toups
Hates your favorite videogame
Joined: 26 Jan 2005
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Location: Lafayette, LA
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| Posted: Fri Dec 01, 2006 4:28 pm Post subject: |
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| Nana Komatsu wrote: | | Toups your title changed. Change it back. |
I will... once you finish.
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extralife
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Joined: 22 Jun 2005
Posts: 233
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| Posted: Fri Dec 01, 2006 6:27 pm Post subject: |
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| Mr Mustache wrote: | | Guardian, despite your strong feelings about the game's merit, if Shadow of the Colossus, or any other work of art, fails on a fundamental level to engage the viewer, the blame for this failure lies (for the most part) with the work in question, not the spectator (participator?). |
That's what I sort of said in my post that everyone took way too seriously and then deleted out the "Ketch I will kill you for this injustice" comment.
Guys I don't really want to kill Ketch
I don't want to poison your river with IC or anything, but inty's point was valid, and I expanded upon it and then joked to make sure you all knew I didn't want to start a fight. Seemed ok?
Anyway, Beyond Good and Evil: I pretty well love it because playing it doesn't feel like playing any other game. Michel Ancel seems to know how to use the medium to express himself, and thus I will forgive his game being more of a demo than anything else. Bare bones, forced story, small world, all that jazz--it did what it wanted to do, it just parred it all down to make sure it was...executable, I guess. Too bad Ubi freaked and locked him in a cage after the game sold four copies. |
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Ketch
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Joined: 17 Sep 2005
Posts: 420
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| Posted: Fri Dec 01, 2006 6:45 pm Post subject: |
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Calm down guys  . I did try to play without reading up on how to get to the colossus, but after spending half an hour galloping round the mountains. almost bored to tears, I decided to just read how to get to the bits that actually interest me. I just don't appreciate mindless horse-riding as a form of entertainment. It would make a good screensaver though. I'm still enjoying the game now that it has warmed up, just killed no 13.
There are many things that it does right, but as in the GQ Prince of Hearts article (PoP:SOT, Ico point-counter-point). It is a matter of different strokes for different folks. I want to see a game that improves on SOTC in the way that arguably Sands of Time did on ICO. I just hope Jordan Mechner has been playing SOTC. |
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extralife
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Joined: 22 Jun 2005
Posts: 233
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| Posted: Fri Dec 01, 2006 6:48 pm Post subject: |
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I think Mechner is out of the gaming industry again. Like a great deal of other talented designers, his tastes seem to be too broad for the current single-minded focus of video games. Oh well.
Now someone tell me about The Last Express, because it looked/looks amazing but I've never been able to track down a copy. |
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chompers po pable
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Joined: 10 Nov 2005
Posts: 142
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| Posted: Fri Dec 01, 2006 6:59 pm Post subject: |
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| Ketch wrote: | | Sands of Time [improved]... on ICO. |
never heard this analogy before. i've heard some ppl say that Twilight Princess improves on SotC. sounds like a similar, and interesting (to say the least) analogy. |
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Dracko
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Joined: 10 Oct 2005
Posts: 2613
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| Posted: Fri Dec 01, 2006 7:09 pm Post subject: |
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| extralife wrote: | | Now someone tell me about The Last Express, because it looked/looks amazing but I've never been able to track down a copy. |
It genuinely is amazing. Not only is it stylish in ever way, a complete labour of love, but the game design is fantastically implemented, thanks to the train setting, allowing you to truly explore the story as you see fit, while still being pressed for time.
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extralife
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Joined: 22 Jun 2005
Posts: 233
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| Posted: Fri Dec 01, 2006 7:50 pm Post subject: |
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| chompers po pable wrote: | | Ketch wrote: | | Sands of Time [improved]... on ICO. |
never heard this analogy before. i've heard some ppl say that Twilight Princess improves on SotC. sounds like a similar, and interesting (to say the least) analogy. |
The only Twilight Princess/SotC comparisons I've seen is "SotC is good and TP is not." The Ico/SoT thing is pretty apt, and easy to see. Their focus is different, but they play very similarly, and SoT clearly looked to Ico for level design cues. |
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Shapermc
Hot Sake!
Joined: 14 Oct 2004
Posts: 6279
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| Posted: Fri Dec 01, 2006 8:31 pm Post subject: |
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| chompers po pable wrote: | | Ketch wrote: | | Sands of Time [improved]... on ICO. |
never heard this analogy before. i've heard some ppl say that Twilight Princess improves on SotC. sounds like a similar, and interesting (to say the least) analogy. |
There's a whole article on it for Issue 2. It may be rough in retrospect, but we were still just starting back then.
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chompers po pable
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Joined: 10 Nov 2005
Posts: 142
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| Posted: Fri Dec 01, 2006 8:50 pm Post subject: |
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| i'm surprised i haven't read it. i will do that sometime. |
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Mr. Apol
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Joined: 22 Feb 2006
Posts: 157
Location: a curiously familiar pit
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| Posted: Fri Dec 01, 2006 9:20 pm Post subject: |
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gradius 3 has a totally better boss rush
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dessgeega
loves your favorite videogame
Joined: 16 Jun 2005
Posts: 6563
Location: bohan
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| Posted: Fri Dec 01, 2006 11:29 pm Post subject: |
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| extralife wrote: | | Now someone tell me about The Last Express, because it looked/looks amazing but I've never been able to track down a copy. |
zarf has a good primer on all the clever tricks the game pulls.
it's very ambitious, yet focused. you spend a lot of time sneaking around and eavesdropping. (i spent a lot of time snooping on the sapphists.) the "puzzles" all make sense as actions to the point where (like riven) it becomes hard to classify them as "puzzles". there are (sometimes strict) time limits, but they reinforce the believability of the world and give your actions drama and urgency. you feel very crafty when you manage to reach the next station alive.
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extralife
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Joined: 22 Jun 2005
Posts: 233
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| Posted: Fri Dec 01, 2006 11:35 pm Post subject: |
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| dessgeega wrote: | | (i spent a lot of time snooping on the sapphists.) |
total extralife game amirite
Also: sold.
Not that I was expecting it to suck or anything. I wish broderbund/whoever produced more than six copies. |
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!=
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Joined: 29 Nov 2006
Posts: 15
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| Posted: Fri Dec 01, 2006 11:37 pm Post subject: |
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The following is pretty rough, and written on the spot. I haven't given much thought on the topic, nor tried to analyze Shadow of the Colossus. But as someone who's been having a great time with it I, I have the following to say:
If anyone want to compare Shadow the Colossus and Zelda : Twilight Princess, I think it has more to do with the former being important, noteworthy, rather than being "better" at it. It's a remarkable, succesful work, remarkable because it manages to induce emotion by the virtue of its videogame nature. Not despite of it.
It does not appear (as a Zelda infidel) that Zelda ever tried to reach an emotional level. It appears mostly concerned with gameplay aspects. Zelda is pretty proud of it and likes to throw new gameplay mechanics at a player. It's aiming to be a good game. Shadow of the colossus aimed to be a good experience.
Another very important aspect of Shadow of the Colossus is how it manages to remain the vision of its creators, while giving control to the player. The camera work, the way music is subtly creating an emphatic atmosphere as you challenge a colossus. You, player, collaborate to the esthetic experience. It's not a simple detail or an added bonus. |
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dessgeega
loves your favorite videogame
Joined: 16 Jun 2005
Posts: 6563
Location: bohan
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| Posted: Fri Dec 01, 2006 11:43 pm Post subject: |
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| extralife wrote: | | Not that I was expecting it to suck or anything. I wish broderbund/whoever produced more than six copies. |
it's on gametap. i used a gametap two-week free trial just to play this game.
(and the caves of doctor pseudo.)
just be warned that to cancel a gametap account you need to call them up and sit through their ridiculous ads for old games. actually the castlevania one is pretty amazing. "crack that whip!"
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extralife
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Joined: 22 Jun 2005
Posts: 233
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| Posted: Fri Dec 01, 2006 11:51 pm Post subject: |
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| Also of note: why hadn't I ever seen that guy's site before? He may not be a writer, but he's at least writing something intersting about video games! How novel. |
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dessgeega
loves your favorite videogame
Joined: 16 Jun 2005
Posts: 6563
Location: bohan
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| Posted: Fri Dec 01, 2006 11:53 pm Post subject: |
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wait huh.
i was pretty sure that zarf's interactive fiction was the sort of thing that would make you cream your jeans.
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extralife
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Joined: 22 Jun 2005
Posts: 233
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| Posted: Fri Dec 01, 2006 11:58 pm Post subject: |
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Well, I'm not really much of an IF/graphic adventure kind of guy, really. Every now and again something will pop up from that underground that compels me, but I don't actively seek these things.
This man, however, seems to understand video games; he has no objection to letting us know what a game does and doesn't do. So I like these reviews! |
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Shapermc
Hot Sake!
Joined: 14 Oct 2004
Posts: 6279
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| Posted: Sat Dec 02, 2006 12:03 pm Post subject: |
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| != wrote: | | It does not appear (as a Zelda infidel) that Zelda ever tried to reach an emotional level. It appears mostly concerned with gameplay aspects. Zelda is pretty proud of it and likes to throw new gameplay mechanics at a player. It's aiming to be a good game. Shadow of the colossus aimed to be a good experience. |
Yeah, that's pretty much right. Everything that TP takes from SotC is mechanical or gameplay related. That said, the motivation and storytelling in TP is much better than Zelda has been in a really long time (then again, I will say this everytime I talk about Zelda, but I havn't played Majora's Mask), so they're learning.
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"There is no place in this enterprise for a rogue physicist!" |
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shnozlak
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Joined: 05 Jul 2005
Posts: 33
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| Posted: Sat Dec 02, 2006 12:39 pm Post subject: |
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| Mr Mustache wrote: | Guardian, despite your strong feelings about the game's merit, if Shadow of the Colossus, or any other work of art, fails on a fundamental level to engage the viewer, the blame for this failure lies (for the most part) with the work in question, not the spectator (participator?).
Additionally, a great many people have jobs and (unbelievably) other interests. Games can simply take far too much time, and while this may be enjoyable to some, it is entirely understandable that one would choose to forgo "exploring the landscape...only roughly directed by the sword's light" in favor of a more efficient experience.
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Driving through a national forest isn’t as pleasant as hiking it, gulping wine isn’t as nice as sipping it, books on tape aren’t as good as the reading them, movies in a packed theater are more impactful than DVDs on the plane, music is better when you sit and clear you mind while you listen to it, shadow of the colossus is better when you take your time.
Is shadow of the colosus just a thing you do while wating for the credits to roll? Or is it wandering a beautiful landscape untill you discover your adversary, a giant stone and earth beastie, living in a mysterious hidden area?
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Dracko
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Joined: 10 Oct 2005
Posts: 2613
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| Posted: Sat Dec 02, 2006 12:45 pm Post subject: |
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I could easily disagree with any of those.
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shnozlak
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Joined: 05 Jul 2005
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| Posted: Sat Dec 02, 2006 12:58 pm Post subject: |
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| Dracko wrote: | | I could easily disagree with any of those. |
Well sure, you could construct contridictory sentences to anything a person would say, but not without being unreasonable.
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Dracko
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| Posted: Sat Dec 02, 2006 1:08 pm Post subject: |
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I know some people who prefer a good drive to a walk. I know some who'd rather down their alcohol, wine or otherwise, rather than savour it. I have a friend who swears by Jeremy Irons reciting Lolita, because she finds it far more tantalising than reading the book. I love listening to music while I work. Packed theatres are noisy, smelly, and typically filled with annoying gips who constantly feel the need to ask the person next to them what the Hell is going on, whereas on a flight, most people are either asleep, doing something, or shutting up. I could go on.
So why the Hell shouldn't someone be able to enjoy a game by rushing through it if that's what they see fit?
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OtakupunkX
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Joined: 23 Mar 2006
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| Posted: Sat Dec 02, 2006 1:18 pm Post subject: |
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| dongle wrote: | | I'm surprised there hasn't been much talk of the horses. SotC's horse animations and interface were amazing, if not user friendly. |
I really want to talk about the horse, but I can't think of anything important to say about it other than the fact that it was implemented amazingly.
I think the fact that there hasn't been much talk of the horses is probably a good sign of some kind.
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Kipple
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Joined: 26 Nov 2006
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| Posted: Sat Dec 02, 2006 3:06 pm Post subject: |
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| OtakupunkX wrote: | | dongle wrote: | | I'm surprised there hasn't been much talk of the horses. SotC's horse animations and interface were amazing, if not user friendly. |
I really want to talk about the horse, but I can't think of anything important to say about it other than the fact that it was implemented amazingly.
I think the fact that there hasn't been much talk of the horses is probably a good sign of some kind. |
I'll talk about the horse! Too bad it's a bad sign of some kind...
The single button responsible for calling and controlling Agro is the X button, which is traditionally responsible for either jumping or attacking. The X button, by virtue of its placement on the controller, is the primary button, used for selecting choices in menus and almost always assigned to the most frequently used (and therefore most important) action in a game. Ueda made a decision that the highest priority action in the game would not be jumping or attacking, but instead calling and riding Agro.
So Agro's important not only because he's always hanging around and he's useful for travelling, but also because the control scheme emphasizes his primary importance. So, when Agro falls down the chasm before the final colossus, your X button suddenly becomes useless. The player's not just sad because of the presentation, but also disoriented because an entire button, the most important button, no longer functions. I thought it was an interesting way of linking emotional response to the player's sense of control. |
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internisus
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Joined: 25 Nov 2006
Posts: 354
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| Posted: Sat Dec 02, 2006 3:36 pm Post subject: |
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That is a good point!
| dessgeega wrote: | wait huh.
i was pretty sure that zarf's interactive fiction was the sort of thing that would make you cream your jeans. |
Yeah, I'm pretty much in love with that Plotkin guy. He has written tons of pretty seminal IF, and he gets his hands on anything resembling Myst that he can, but he can't stand Lucasarts/Sierra style adventure games, and he spends his life trying to understand why. He approaches games like Silent Hill 2 and Ico from the perspective of someone whose life revolves around IF, which is very interesting! He plays and enjoys non-IF games all the time, like Super Mario Sunshine, for example, but there is something very different about his vantage point when he gets down with something like Silent Hill compared to, well, anyone on this board. He's extremely thorough and exacting in his writing, but accessible as well. I want to read his whole website and write a book report on it, to come up with conclusions that make use of his vast body of work. I wonder if he's played SotC? Let me check!
Yes!
| Andrew Plotkin wrote: | What impresses me about SOTC is that it conveys the experience of clinging precariously to the back of a thrashing monster, while still leaving your choices in the adventure realm (do I climb up, climb around, jump off...) as opposed to the action realm (do I succeed at the button-mashing, or -- oh, dammit).
Is it better than Ico? Well, it is similar and it is different. I've replayed Ico about three times; even though I've memorized all the puzzles, working through it is relaxing. Working through SOTC is not relaxing. The action challenges, despite being subservient to the puzzles, are real. I would not enjoy redoing them; I'd get frustrated at the inevitable failures.
And, somehow, SOTC feels less varied than Ico. I don't have a good explanation for this. Each colossus is a brand-new puzzle, which requires new thinking about the tools and commands at your disposal. The landscape is immense and richly textured; every corner you turn reveals a new and hand-crafted work of beauty. Even if you consider only the colossus challenge areas, they're all unique.
But something is missing. I think it's a sense of variety in travel. The landscape has variety, but you travel it all by gee-upping your horse. Run, run, run. Ico, or for that matter Prince of Persia, gives you lots of engaged variety as you move through the game -- even when you're just navigating to the next interesting area. You run, then you climb, then you swing, etc.
Now, SOTC is going for landscape rather than architecture, so maybe there's no way around this. You can't cover five miles of rolling hills if you're crawling from rock to rock. (And it's not like the backtracking in PoP: Warrior Within didn't get tedious.) But this is a spot -- really, a large percentage of the game -- where you don't feel involved, despite the artistry of what you're looking at. Oh well.
But, in case I didn't make this clear: SOTC is the most beautiful piece of work I've seen in a video game. The next three years of artistic design in gaming will consist of stealing ideas from SOTC. No surprise there; that's what happened after Ico.
I have some inchoate theory about how what I really love in these games is the same thing I really love in Myst, which is enormous and fantastical architecture. Forget complicity, forget ranges of choice, forget unique game-state responses. It's all about the megaliths. |
Highly relevant!
P.S. I wonder how, precisely, the man makes his living. |
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Rud13
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Joined: 01 Jul 2005
Posts: 130
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| Posted: Sat Dec 02, 2006 6:12 pm Post subject: |
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| Dracko wrote: | I know some people who prefer a good drive to a walk. I know some who'd rather down their alcohol, wine or otherwise, rather than savour it. I have a friend who swears by Jeremy Irons reciting Lolita, because she finds it far more tantalising than reading the book. I love listening to music while I work. Packed theatres are noisy, smelly, and typically filled with annoying gips who constantly feel the need to ask the person next to them what the Hell is going on, whereas on a flight, most people are either asleep, doing something, or shutting up. I could go on.
So why the Hell shouldn't someone be able to enjoy a game by rushing through it if that's what they see fit? |
Because you're disregarding what is regarded as the recommended (I will not make judgements on the actual designer) experience. "This is how you should probably play the game to get the full experience." "But I don't want to do it that way!" "Well then any complaints about a lacking experience might be null and void?"
So on and so forth. I'm also trying to dodge the life value judgements problem we are fixing to have.
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Dracko
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Joined: 10 Oct 2005
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| Posted: Sat Dec 02, 2006 6:16 pm Post subject: |
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Cute, but I don't recall Fumito Ueda saying anything of the sort. Even if he did, then there's no reason to leap at people's throats because he's being purposefully ecclectic. If it fails to engage them, then he should probably revise the development.
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Rud13
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Joined: 01 Jul 2005
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| Posted: Sat Dec 02, 2006 6:19 pm Post subject: |
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Well if it engaged many people, and ostraized or didn't interest a few, then I say he had done sucessfully.
Banging brick walls.
Just for the record I don't really like SotC that much. I'm willing to chalk that up to personal tastes versus failure on the designers part though.
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Dracko
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| Posted: Sat Dec 02, 2006 6:20 pm Post subject: |
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Which was never truly in question. What is in question, and what some seem to shudder in disbelief over, is the fact that some people didn't like it, and why they didn't like it. Simply saying "You just don't get it" or "You're doing it wrong" is unhelpful.
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Ethoscapade
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Joined: 30 Oct 2005
Posts: 276
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| Posted: Sat Dec 02, 2006 6:41 pm Post subject: |
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| Mister Toups wrote: | | guardian I just realized you have posted 135 times since registering on Sunday. |
this is actually somewhat charming after you've spent an afternoon with the guy.
he "doesn't see the value in humor on an ideological level," i'll say that much, and i'm paraphrasing, but! |
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Scratchmonkey
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Joined: 02 Mar 2005
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| Posted: Sat Dec 02, 2006 6:55 pm Post subject: |
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| Dracko wrote: | | Which was never truly in question. What is in question, and what some seem to shudder in disbelief over, is the fact that some people didn't like it, and why they didn't like it. Simply saying "You just don't get it" or "You're doing it wrong" is unhelpful. |
Well, saying "have you tried approaching the game like this?" might actually be helpful. Of course, it might not, if the person doesn't feel like playing the game that way and people don't generally couch their objections in an empathetic manner anyway. |
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internisus
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Joined: 25 Nov 2006
Posts: 354
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| Posted: Sat Dec 02, 2006 6:56 pm Post subject: |
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| ha! i always regret whenever i make a generalization about myself that way. it's mostly true, though. humor is low on my list of priorities. lately i have found a somewhat addictive entertainment in ironic axe posting, though. like that thread i made on the child raising experiment? no one seems to have found that ironic or funny though. i fail a lot. |
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Mister Toups
Hates your favorite videogame
Joined: 26 Jan 2005
Posts: 1693
Location: Lafayette, LA
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| Posted: Sat Dec 02, 2006 6:59 pm Post subject: |
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| internisus wrote: | | ha! i always regret whenever i make a generalization about myself that way. it's mostly true, though. humor is low on my list of priorities. lately i have found a somewhat addictive entertainment in ironic axe posting, though. like that thread i made on the child raising experiment? no one seems to have found that ironic or funny though. i fail a lot. |
well it is kind of hard to tell with you.
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Cycle
Mac daddy
Joined: 08 Sep 2006
Posts: 2767
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| Posted: Sat Dec 02, 2006 7:00 pm Post subject: |
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| man i already said what that andrew ploktin said about ICO and Riven except better because i wrote it |
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internisus
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Joined: 25 Nov 2006
Posts: 354
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| Posted: Sat Dec 02, 2006 7:05 pm Post subject: |
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| Mister Toups wrote: | | internisus wrote: | | ha! i always regret whenever i make a generalization about myself that way. it's mostly true, though. humor is low on my list of priorities. lately i have found a somewhat addictive entertainment in ironic axe posting, though. like that thread i made on the child raising experiment? no one seems to have found that ironic or funny though. i fail a lot. |
well it is kind of hard to tell with you. |
whereas you're so easy to figure out, being a complete ass 95% of the time. |
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Rud13
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Joined: 01 Jul 2005
Posts: 130
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| Posted: Sat Dec 02, 2006 7:05 pm Post subject: |
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is Andrew Plokin australian? If not, you are better than him in two ways.
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Mister Toups
Hates your favorite videogame
Joined: 26 Jan 2005
Posts: 1693
Location: Lafayette, LA
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| Posted: Sat Dec 02, 2006 7:06 pm Post subject: |
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| internisus wrote: | | Mister Toups wrote: | | internisus wrote: | | ha! i always regret whenever i make a generalization about myself that way. it's mostly true, though. humor is low on my list of priorities. lately i have found a somewhat addictive entertainment in ironic axe posting, though. like that thread i made on the child raising experiment? no one seems to have found that ironic or funny though. i fail a lot. |
well it is kind of hard to tell with you. |
whereas you're so easy to figure out, being a complete ass 95% of the time. |
:'(
or were you being sarcastic.
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antitype
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Joined: 11 Jan 2006
Posts: 292
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| Posted: Sat Dec 02, 2006 7:14 pm Post subject: |
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It's cool to have a subtle/nuanced personality, internisus.
I appreciated the irony, too, though I went about it myself in less subtle ways. By posting a thread with the subject line, "guys, a thread" and the entire body of text consisting of "guys", for example.
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antitype.livejournal.com | last.fm
Last edited by antitype on Sat Dec 02, 2006 7:20 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Ethoscapade
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Joined: 30 Oct 2005
Posts: 276
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| Posted: Sat Dec 02, 2006 7:18 pm Post subject: |
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| <3 |
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Dracko
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Joined: 10 Oct 2005
Posts: 2613
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| Posted: Sat Dec 02, 2006 7:21 pm Post subject: |
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| Scratchmonkey wrote: | | Well, saying "have you tried approaching the game like this?" might actually be helpful. |
True as this may be, it still points out that there may be something inherently flawed in the game design proper.
Not that I've never come across a piece of art that wasn't flawed, but still. In this instance, it seems worthy of investigation: Is there something in this game, in the presentation, the controls or what-have-you, something beyond the ambience, that may be going against the mood and type of playfulness it's aiming for?
I can play through any of Valve's games in two ways: Take my time, investigating every corner, totally in character, relying on cover, building up the tension or getting lost in my environment. Or I can rush on through, metaphysically flipping off every NPC I come across, on my little murder high, running and gunning like a lunatic. Is one way better than the other? Perhaps, but both acknowledge the simple fact that I'm in a game.
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"This is the most fun I've ever had without being drenched in the blood of my enemies!" |
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internisus
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Joined: 25 Nov 2006
Posts: 354
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| Posted: Sat Dec 02, 2006 7:30 pm Post subject: |
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| Dracko wrote: | | Scratchmonkey wrote: | | Well, saying "have you tried approaching the game like this?" might actually be helpful. |
True as this may be, it still points out that there may be something inherently flawed in the game design proper. |
I don't think this is so obviously the case. It may be as simple as the fact that some people do not appreciate landscape paintings. There is nothing wrong with those landcape paintings. They just do not appeal to everyone. However, having a guide explain to you exactly what your eye should look to in those paintings is defeatist. |
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