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kirkjerk .
Joined: 12 Apr 2006 Posts: 1227
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Posted: Sat Oct 14, 2006 9:27 pm Post subject: on the feminization of game controllers |
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Ok, this is obvious and/or sophomoric, but because of a certain boudoir conversation I got to thinking about how controllers have gotten feminized. Or something. From the single phallic 2600 stick to the more nuanced and involved controllers of today.
Admittedly the analogy is far from perfect. But I might not be the first person in the history of games to note the similarities betweenm, say, vigorously coaxing forth an obstinately shy orgasm from a woman by hand, and doing well at an early Mario Party Minigame. Both can from time to time require a fair amount of persistance and dextrous stamina.
Ok I've said too much. I'd say don't drink and post, but I haven't been drinking. |
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dhex Breeder
Joined: 13 Dec 2004 Posts: 6319 Location: brooklyn, Nev Yiork
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Posted: Sat Oct 14, 2006 9:35 pm Post subject: |
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isn't the wii like, well, shaped and sounds like wee?
on your note, i look forward to the first snopes debunking of "girl gets wii stuck in the garden of delights and ends up in hospital" emails. _________________
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dessgeega loves your favorite videogame
Joined: 16 Jun 2005 Posts: 6563 Location: bohan
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Posted: Sat Oct 14, 2006 9:37 pm Post subject: |
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jane pinckard's talked about this too.
i like playing with buttons more than with sticks. _________________
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Nana Komatsu weak sauce
Joined: 17 Jul 2006 Posts: 1293
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Posted: Sat Oct 14, 2006 9:57 pm Post subject: |
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Redeye .
Joined: 02 Oct 2006 Posts: 986 Location: filth
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Posted: Sat Oct 14, 2006 11:40 pm Post subject: |
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Nana Komatsu wrote: | |
Next iteration: dual-shock and a wii dock. _________________ I felt sheer anarchic joy when I ran over my first pedestrian. |
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simplicio .
Joined: 03 May 2005 Posts: 1091
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Posted: Sun Oct 15, 2006 12:12 am Post subject: |
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Nana Komatsu wrote: | |
Yikes, is that a photoshop or did it actually take me this long to realize how vaginal that prototype was? |
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Scratchmonkey .
Joined: 02 Mar 2005 Posts: 1439
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kirkjerk .
Joined: 12 Apr 2006 Posts: 1227
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Posted: Sun Oct 15, 2006 8:13 am Post subject: |
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It's funny where large control sticks are still around: like those giant "flight control" sticks you see at Best Buy, absurdly macho. I used to get humbler versions of those for "Wing Commander" back in the day.
So big sticks are obviously bad for sudden changes of direction, but I imagine they're a bit better at subtle degrees of movement. If I had to guess, I'd say 360-degree control is more important than "a little vs a lot" sensitivity. |
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player 2 .
Joined: 10 Jul 2005 Posts: 585 Location: Madison, WI USA
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Posted: Sun Oct 15, 2006 11:16 am Post subject: |
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I think that little vs. a lot dichotomyis what really is driving the trend towards "feminine" controllers. I don't really like the analogy, much, though because I think it's more psychological than male vs. female.
What I really mean is that before videogames were direct commands. A causes B. There was nothing subtle about them. But as time went on, we came to realize that subtlety is a good thing. Miyamoto introduces the analog stick with Mario 64 and Mario has to admit his imperfection by reigning in that stick. Does anyone else feel the urge to tilt the stick all the way when tiptoeing across a narrow gap? Because I know I do, and I know that I fall half the time when I try. Some girls never tell you to be careful, they just stop talking to you when you fuck up.
Resident Evil and Silent Hill played with visuals and sounds that, while differing in degrees of subtlety, broke the empiricism we were trained to learn. A doesn't always cause B. The interface (not just the controller) changed to be more subtle, too. Also, whenever I think about how the next gen lacks rumble, I think about Silent Hill and I cry a little.
I don't think it's necessarily a female thing as much as it is a thing about sensitivity. And while we can make jokes about that all day, I don't think it's really that beneficial. Looking at games in this respect, the Wii is probably the most interesting concept ever made. It can understand your subtle movements - a flick of the wrist, sure, but also nervousness. _________________ Wii #: 8749 9109 9732 3653
"It is a peaceful way of understanding life, to play"
_Marcel Duchamp |
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Lackey .
Joined: 11 Jul 2005 Posts: 1107 Location: Canada
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Posted: Sun Oct 15, 2006 12:14 pm Post subject: |
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Remember how girls totally loved Centipede because of the bright colours and because it used a trackball! Remember also how it was totally designed by a woman (and also Ed Logg)!
If you want to talk about sensitivity in controllers you should probably mention the MINDLINK which is the most serious form of controller ever conceived. To require complete mental concentration, to use only your mind to interact with the game -that was the future.
I haven't used a joystick in years, but I can tell you this; X-Wing feels really really wrong played with keyboard buttons. _________________ | Little bird fighting against a bat sect game | |
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kirkjerk .
Joined: 12 Apr 2006 Posts: 1227
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Posted: Sun Oct 15, 2006 12:42 pm Post subject: |
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I really wish there were a cheap home version of that alpha waves monitor thing, where you get to try to "outchill" your opponent; the paradox of "competitive relaxing" appeals to me greatly.
Slashdot recently had a piece on a new bit of exercise bike that you can use at a desk... that idea has been floating around for a while, but there's never been a breakout implementation. I always thought that "Prop Cycle" arcade game would make an inspiration home port... |
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Lackey .
Joined: 11 Jul 2005 Posts: 1107 Location: Canada
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dhex Breeder
Joined: 13 Dec 2004 Posts: 6319 Location: brooklyn, Nev Yiork
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Posted: Sun Oct 15, 2006 5:12 pm Post subject: |
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i'm still really confused. what's feminine about the wii? it's the most phallic controller ever designed. _________________
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kirkjerk .
Joined: 12 Apr 2006 Posts: 1227
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Posted: Sun Oct 15, 2006 5:12 pm Post subject: |
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Lackey wrote: | What is the Alpha Waves monitor thing? I've never heard of this before. |
Googling "outchill your opponent" got me to MindBall, which is pretty much as I described
(Appropriately enough, I couldn't get to that Wiki page directly because of some server issues there and had to use the Google cache.) Yeah, a bit like that, though maybe the measurement is more direct...
Ah, the early days of Amiga hardware... the Powerstick was awesome, even though you gripped it rather than thumbed it, its size was almost a precursor of the N64/Dual Shock era.
Quote: | edit: I thought you were talking about this sort of alpha wave. |
Oh yeah, that game... I found it very frustrating, thoug I thought that the background of the high score screen (I think it was) was lovely, and would have made a great screensaver if you could just take out the lettering... |
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Nana Komatsu weak sauce
Joined: 17 Jul 2006 Posts: 1293
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Posted: Sun Oct 15, 2006 7:21 pm Post subject: |
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player 2 wrote: | Does anyone else feel the urge to tilt the stick all the way when tiptoeing across a narrow gap? Because I know I do, and I know that I fall half the time when I try. Some girls never tell you to be careful, they just stop talking to you when you fuck up. |
... what?
player 2 wrote: | Resident Evil and Silent Hill played with visuals and sounds that, while differing in degrees of subtlety, broke the empiricism we were trained to learn. A doesn't always cause B. |
I think this has more to do with Resident Evil having really terrible controls. |
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Mister Toups Hates your favorite videogame
Joined: 26 Jan 2005 Posts: 1693 Location: Lafayette, LA
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Posted: Sun Oct 15, 2006 7:47 pm Post subject: |
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Nana Komatsu wrote: | I think this has more to do with Resident Evil having really terrible controls. |
Man, you haven't even played Rule of Rose yet. Talk about a game where A doesn't necessarily cause B.
Also RE's controls aren't that bad, they just demand a different style of play. _________________ where were you when nana komatsu got a wii? |
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Lackey .
Joined: 11 Jul 2005 Posts: 1107 Location: Canada
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Posted: Sun Oct 15, 2006 8:28 pm Post subject: |
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dhex wrote: | i'm still really confused. what's feminine about the wii? it's the most phallic controller ever designed. |
I was wondering about that too. I guess it's the way you use it?
kirk wrote: | Googling "outchill your opponent" got me to MindBall, which is pretty much as I described |
And on the oposite end of the spectrum is the PainStation. _________________ | Little bird fighting against a bat sect game | |
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Scratchmonkey .
Joined: 02 Mar 2005 Posts: 1439
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Posted: Sun Oct 15, 2006 8:42 pm Post subject: |
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Anecdote time!
My wife and I were watching some early-games documentary (can't remember which one) and one of the desginers was talking about using trackballs and how they decided to use them because they were more "feminine" and when he did this, he put his hands in front of his chest and made circular motions.
My wife: "Did anybody tell these guys that breasts don't rotate?" |
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kirkjerk .
Joined: 12 Apr 2006 Posts: 1227
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Posted: Sun Oct 15, 2006 9:06 pm Post subject: |
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Scratchmonkey wrote: | Anecdote time!
My wife and I were watching some early-games documentary (can't remember which one) and one of the desginers was talking about using trackballs and how they decided to use them because they were more "feminine" and when he did this, he put his hands in front of his chest and made circular motions.
My wife: "Did anybody tell these guys that breasts don't rotate?" |
That's a good anecdote.
Reminds me of the Pong/Atari Paddle control, and where they fit in the sex organ / game controller spetrum.
Also, huh. You don't see many "paddles" these days, but I guess there's a parallel evolution:
gripped joystick -> modern thumbstick
paddle controller -> modern scrollwheel
Not that there's a lot of scrollwheels on console games.
And one small drawback to the rise of the thumbstick is that the "Ikari Warriors" type controller has fallen by the wayside, which was a nice alternative answer to "how do we let the player move one direction and fire in another" than the Robtron/Smash TV two-sticks solution.
"Heavy Barrel" made an inordinately large impression on me back in the day.
I've never gotten into "Metal Gear Solid" but it seems to me they share a similar naming scheme. |
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dessgeega loves your favorite videogame
Joined: 16 Jun 2005 Posts: 6563 Location: bohan
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Posted: Sun Oct 15, 2006 9:17 pm Post subject: |
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kirkjerk wrote: | Reminds me of the Pong/Atari Paddle control, and where they fit in the sex organ / game controller spetrum. |
paddles and dials and wheels are pretty swell. too bad there's usually no home console equivalent, though taito's done a pretty good job using the ds touchscreen to emulate them in a few games. have we talked about the ds yet? i ought to get paddle controller for my jaguar. _________________
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Lackey .
Joined: 11 Jul 2005 Posts: 1107 Location: Canada
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Posted: Sun Oct 15, 2006 9:18 pm Post subject: |
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I've never played an Ikari Warriors cabinet. How does the Joystick work? Do you rotate the handle as well as tilting it around?
But scratchmonkey, that doesn't preclude the function of that gesture! _________________ | Little bird fighting against a bat sect game | |
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kirkjerk .
Joined: 12 Apr 2006 Posts: 1227
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Posted: Sun Oct 15, 2006 10:06 pm Post subject: |
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Lackey wrote: | I've never played an Ikari Warriors cabinet. How does the Joystick work? Do you rotate the handle as well as tilting it around? |
After KLOVing a bit:
Yah, Ikari Warriors and Heavy Barrel (and one or two others, I had forgotten about "Makyou Senshi") had these yellow-handled tops, similar in feel to a nicely grooved screwdriver handle, and you could rotate to the 8 compass points and have your guy's gun point that way.
Heh, the Klov page for Ikari warriors mentions that it was a popular game to port to consoles, but few did a great job w/ the control.
And then I was trying to remember why there was no Ikari Warriors 2 and it went straight to 3... then I remembered "Victory Road", which was one of the first 3 games I got when I got an NES.
"Zang Zip the War Dog." I almost want to track down a ROM just to see what HE'S all about |
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dhex Breeder
Joined: 13 Dec 2004 Posts: 6319 Location: brooklyn, Nev Yiork
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Posted: Mon Oct 16, 2006 7:37 am Post subject: |
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Quote: | My wife: "Did anybody tell these guys that breasts don't rotate?" |
probably not.
also, i'd really like to give the painstation a try. i have a very high pain threshold and can probably take getting the shit zapped out of me.
but on the home console level, maybe we'll see a less dangerous reiteration of that? taking vibration to the next level, as it were. _________________
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kirkjerk .
Joined: 12 Apr 2006 Posts: 1227
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Posted: Mon Oct 16, 2006 9:05 am Post subject: |
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dhex wrote: | also, i'd really like to give the painstation a try. i have a very high pain threshold and can probably take getting the shit zapped out of me. |
Heh. My sixth grade class room had a powerstrip mounted on the edge of this metal-fronted shelving and if you touched the shelving and the radiator a tingling charge would build up and up 'til finally you let go. I could stay there and hold it the longest.
Soon after i started doing really well on standardized tests. Maybe there's a tie-in?
Hmm, but other than that my pain tolerance is no great shakes, especially when sudden and unexpected.. |
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Redeye .
Joined: 02 Oct 2006 Posts: 986 Location: filth
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Posted: Tue Oct 17, 2006 4:04 pm Post subject: |
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kirkjerk wrote: | I really wish there were a cheap home version of that alpha waves monitor thing, where you get to try to "outchill" your opponent; the paradox of "competitive relaxing" appeals to me greatly.
<snip>
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Jedi Gaming _________________ I felt sheer anarchic joy when I ran over my first pedestrian. |
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