The Gamer's Quarter

dhex · Posted: Fri Aug 04, 2006 9:49 am Post subject:

well, that argument comes in two flavors:

1) the oh my god this is the worst thing ever (with or without the added taint of "oh noes negroes!") it's both ahistorical (johnny cash, gg allin, etc) and vaguely racist. a much better criticism is that it's insanely egotistical in a way that requires tremendous talent to stand over the ridiculously overblown stirner-in-a-can machismo.

2) oh man, it's the most raw music ever, man. wow. check out these nasty sex jams.

both are shortsighted stances. as with everything from video games to organic produce to anarcho-syndicalism, you can always find someone more hardcore than you. (officially termed the "more-hardcore-than-thou" routine (tm), patent pending) there's always someone who pushes the envelope a bit more, especially now that there's greater access to instantaneous communication. this is largely a good thing, regardless of its sometimes misplaced applications (bethesda's oblivion boards) but it makes comfort a bit more difficult unless one is comfortable with taste not being an immutable law of nature but rather an opinion of sorts. (hi ayn!)

i also like passing around whitehouse as an example of how far tastelessness can go. they're not like anal cunt, which is genuinely funny at times. i've been told whitehouse is funny, but i don't really see that much humor in it, except the sort of post-industrial fuck you fuck everyone eat shit and die thing you'd get at the turn of the 1970s from monte cazazza or boyd rice. (i genuinely like much of what rice did, however, whereas i don't really see the art in either cazazza or bennett's work. [insert standard libertarian disclaimer of defending one's right to say awful things here])

that said, there are some really great dancehall sex jams, though i am ambivalent at the thought of supporting nearly cartoonish rastafari homophobes (in the genuine sense of the term) with my sex jam dollars.
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Dracko · . Joined: 10 Oct 2005 Posts: 2613

A few Whitehouse fans informed me that the misanthropy and misoginy is actually suppoed to be a condemnation of the kind of people Bennett vocalises. I'm not sure I buy that, but I still think Why You Never Became a Dancer is actually a pretty clever song. The rest of their catalogue feels kind of stale and repetitive to me, though.

P.S. Ever listened to cLOUDDEAD?

P.P.S. Is it wrong that I occasionally enjoy Cypress Hill?
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"This is the most fun I've ever had without being drenched in the blood of my enemies!"

dhex · Posted: Fri Aug 04, 2006 10:23 am Post subject:

just cause i feel like riffing on this, i'll continue a bit more.

i don't really have a problem with rubbing one's nose in the deritus of the world, as it were. i don't think it's something that only certain classes of people have a lock on, either. i much prefer this (or anime, or tentacle rape porn, etc etc) to actually going out and violating the life and liberty of another person or persons. i do think they act as an outlet; i don't think one absorbs misogyny from mid period burroughs any more than you'd absorb homosexual sex magick tendencies from later period burroughs. (though you might be more inclined to rub semen into a map to figure out where you're going on vacation that summer, maybe...)

i can appreciate brutality in art, and i can truly appreciate the sort of delicious power that comes from being hated. it's truly like no other feeling on earth, like seeing your enemies crushed before you due to direct action. but like any drug, overuse produces insensitivity and addiction. plus it's just not that shocking anymore. tasteless, yes, but very little isn't these days.

i don't really care for the def jux/anticon/thesaurus rap axis of hip hop, so i've never heard any of their stuff.
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simplicio · . Joined: 03 May 2005 Posts: 1091

dhex · Posted: Fri Aug 04, 2006 10:56 am Post subject:

ok, i'll bite (holy shit i am bored today edition):

1) not all sizes fit one; or one size sometimes doesn't fit all, or something like that.

2) if people don't learn to accept a natural kind of media literacy, we'll never get rid of this fucktarded "blank slate" model of human sociology; plus it's really fucking arrogant as an underlying assumption - "my tastes are the product of awesome factors xyz because i am a unique snowflake of unspeakable beauty but yours are all the result of brainwashing by teh corporashuns/liberal media/homosexual agenda/religious right!" besides, nearly everyone was born with a bullshit detector of some sort, even if it seems to point in the wrong direction most of the time; there is no perfectly gullible youth that eats up everything sold to him or her, because there are too many signals. some are lost to filters. did those filters pop up out of nowhere? in a word, maybe!

3) to quote dead prez "all my high school teachers can suck my dick."

4) media and art are largely reflections/symptoms, not directors, of the behavior of peer groups. since peer groups are the greatest influence on anyone's actual behavior as a child and/or young adult, this is one of those "root causes" thing that's harder to crack and understand than a musical genre or artist's output. how does one cause cultural change? is it really because of thumbsucker movies and made for tv morality plays? is it really a case of 1:1 direct payoffs regarding advertising dollars? or is it a far deeper and more multilayered understanding of human behavior that resists such easy categorization?
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Wilkes · milky wilkie Joined: 06 Mar 2006 Posts: 256

what he said
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helicopterp · . Joined: 13 May 2006 Posts: 1435 Location: Philadelphia

I'm gonna go ahead and take a lot less philisophical approach than dhex and say that I think you're entirely missing the point of his lyrics, simplicio. He isn't trying to send a message that he wants kids to drop out of school. His verses about dropping out are personal, and focus a lot more on the fact that he dropped out in order to lock himself in his basement back home and put in hours upon hours trying to perfect his talent for making beats. It's more of a message of putting a lot of work into something that actually means something to you rather than just choosing a certain path because society expects it of you. And the fact that he excelled enough at his craft to form a career out of it--he was (and still is) hugely successful as a young phenom producer before Roc-a-fella ever greenlighted his proposal to cut his own rap album--stands as a testament to the American Dream of the self-made man. And the riches, which aren't get-rich-quick riches, are sources of personal conflict for him. He loves his money, but he doesn't like loving his money so much, and acknowledges that that kind of focus has plagued a lot of mainstream hip-hop. "I always said that if I rapped I'd say something significant, but now I'm rappin' bout money, ho's, and rims again."
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Like you thought you'd seen copter perverts before. They were nothing compared to this one.

simplicio · . Joined: 03 May 2005 Posts: 1091

Understood, entirely. My problem lies entirely within:

Kanye: ("Ironically" "humorous" skit about how higher education's a waste of [his] time.)
12 year old kid: "Oh."

The kids (and who else are you going to hit home with when you create a multi-album focus on the education system?) don't get any subtlety out of that. They hear "money" being touted over "school" and the jump at the chance to identify with it. Shit, I could accuse Kanye of playing directly into the Christian conservative ethos. I could.

And look, that quote's no justification; it's the same as Jay-Z's line about having the ability create conscious raps, but sticking to the party stuff all the same cause that's where the money and fame is. If you know you can do better and you decline to do so, I'm reserving my right to call you an asshole.

But hey. A pack of that same urban youth element just beat the shit out of a complete stranger right outside my work the other day, on their way back from the local pool to the subway. No provocation or anything. Just fucking misguided kids. So maybe that's guiding what I'm feeling here.

Also, I really wish I didn't live in fucking NYC.

dessgeega · Posted: Sat Aug 05, 2006 1:46 am Post subject:

dhex · Posted: Sat Aug 05, 2006 7:03 am Post subject:

Wilkes · milky wilkie Joined: 06 Mar 2006 Posts: 256

simplicio · . Joined: 03 May 2005 Posts: 1091

dhex · Posted: Sat Aug 05, 2006 4:28 pm Post subject:

gotcha. so where'd this dude get jumped?

i'm kinda dubious on the value of higher education for a lot of people anyway.
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J.Goodwin · . Joined: 31 Jul 2006 Posts: 297 Location: North Shore, MA

dhex · Posted: Sat Aug 05, 2006 9:25 pm Post subject:

in brooklyn, it's trance and trad all the way home.
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helicopterp · . Joined: 13 May 2006 Posts: 1435 Location: Philadelphia

Swimmy · . Joined: 16 Sep 2005 Posts: 990 Location: Fairfax, VA

I'm in one of those moods where mediocre videogame music sounds intensely profound. You know the sappy music it plays in the town Crysta in Terranigma? With the weird creaking? Yeah.
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"Ayn Rand fans are the old school version of Xenogears fanboys."
-seryogin

sawtooth · . Joined: 02 Nov 2005 Posts: 419

Does anyone know where this sample comes from (the voice that comes in at about :45)? It's been me for awhile. It sounds like reading of a transcript of a lunatic raving, and I love that stuff. googling some of the more standout phrases gets me a couple other uses of the sample, but nothing leading up to its origins.

But yeah! I really like the cd it comes off of, though. Casino Vs. Japan's self-titled album. Lots of space, reverb, steady drums, and a couple of tropical-sounding flourishes. Not the most original music ever, but very late-night appropriate.
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dhex · Posted: Sun Aug 06, 2006 7:08 am Post subject:

now sleeps ye with that old whore death?

almost sounds like a text to speech proggy.

to expand the subject somewhat, have you guys ever tried to arrange your records in ideological order? it's something that started as a joke about six years ago on another mailing list (the discussion was of miles davis and misogyny; one guy hadn't heard about this and decided to get rid of all his miles davis records, and debate ensued) and it's a lot harder than it looks because of ties.

it's also kinda pointless unless you really feel some sort of connection between an artists' politics and your metaphysical and financial support of them. shit, i actually heard some tardbunny german pagans talking one day a long time ago in other music about how they couldn't buy current 93 albums anymore because david tibet is catholic.
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J.Goodwin · . Joined: 31 Jul 2006 Posts: 297 Location: North Shore, MA

It's from an untitled poem by Ernest Hemingway to one of his wives.

Probably from the LP "Ernest Hemingway Reading."

That LP was also released as CD 4 from "The Ernest Hemingway audio collection"
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Gamertag - FalcomAdol -- Don't Click Here 触手
Playing - Ninety-Nine Nights - Xbox 360

sawtooth · . Joined: 02 Nov 2005 Posts: 419

dhex · Posted: Sun Aug 06, 2006 3:32 pm Post subject:

well, iirc, his point was that he didn't want to listen to davis any more after he found out what kind of guy he was. which, while i can understand, is a very strange slope. it's the line between eccentric and offensive?

edit: i was thinking of this in some ways in relation to prey. i liked the demo, the game is far more interesting than doom 3 (which is a good engine, sez i, for that sort of thing, and is very pretty) but i'm not too hot on the motif. i have no idea whether what they use gets better or worse, and it is decidedly sympathetic to nationalist concerns but it still seems to be stuck in a sort of weird 1980s "like wow, man, indians are so spiritual and stuff" thing.

of course, if they used a dead tradition it wouldn't bother me in the slightest, historical accuracy be damned. i'm not sure games are the correct outlet for covering living traditions. i might turn this into a thread of its own later on.
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helicopterp · . Joined: 13 May 2006 Posts: 1435 Location: Philadelphia

dhex · Posted: Sun Aug 06, 2006 3:55 pm Post subject:

huh? i've never heard anything about that. what, like the tamil tigers funded the release?
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sawtooth · . Joined: 02 Nov 2005 Posts: 419

dhex · Posted: Sun Aug 06, 2006 10:01 pm Post subject:

no, i meant ties as in "ok so you've got silver mt. zion and you've got godspeed, and since one has explicit vocals and the other has packaging does that make silver mt. zion more hardcore?" a dead heat, if you will.

it's more or less silly to the extreme.
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Toto · 4th Man Joined: 21 Mar 2006 Posts: 122

Lately I have been trying to bridge the gap between serious reader, and having read books as a child. As a book addict when I was a child, I read a lot, but now that reading requires effort, due to the nature of books I have lying around the house, I seem to be shying away. So I try to bridge this gap with serious yet fictional books. Dad is major into philosophy; we have every Nietzche book ever written etc. and he's a big fan of Gilles Deleuze.
The book I am reading is called The Burning Plain and Other Stories, by I'm not sure who. It was written in the 1950's by a Mexican, however, and I enjoy the style of it thoroughly.

J.Goodwin · . Joined: 31 Jul 2006 Posts: 297 Location: North Shore, MA

simplicio · . Joined: 03 May 2005 Posts: 1091

Listy time!

Top 10 albums of the year, so far:
White Flight - White Flight
Keith Fullerton Whitman - Lisbon
Juana Molina - Son
Current 93 - Black Ships Ate the Sky
Boris - Pink
Herbert - Scale
Man Man - Six Demon Bag
TV on the Radio - Return to Cookie Mountain
Scott Walker - The Drift
Bonnie 'Prince' Billy - Cursed Sleep Single (hopefully to be replaced the full length Letting Go once that comes out)

And reissues/compliations:
Tropicalia: A Brazilian Revolution In Sound (Soul Jazz)
Tujiko Noriko - Shojo Toshi +
Wayfaring Strangers: Ladies from the Canyon (Numero Group)
Mclusky - Mcluskyism
Not Alone (Durtro Jnana)

That White Flight album has seriously addictive properties for me. I probably haven't listened to a single album this much since Bonnie Billy's I See a Darkness five years ago.

helicopterp · . Joined: 13 May 2006 Posts: 1435 Location: Philadelphia

simplicio · . Joined: 03 May 2005 Posts: 1091

Well, I'm on slsk all the time. Feel free to browse me. I'm totally fascinated by sound I love to hear what other people are finding too.

I really ought to spend more time with NPR; I hear stuff about them like what you just said from time to time, but then I check it out and it's largely boringish folky/alt-country stuff. I guess you have to hit them at the right time. KEXP.org is largely varied and reliable though.

I've always made (pretty half-assed, admittedly) attempts at getting into the Wu Tang stuff, but it still just doesn't connect with me.

J.Goodwin · . Joined: 31 Jul 2006 Posts: 297 Location: North Shore, MA

sawtooth · . Joined: 02 Nov 2005 Posts: 419

Cool! Thanks again.
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simplicio · . Joined: 03 May 2005 Posts: 1091

Ted Leo is a man of lightning and titanium, and perhaps some siren's metronome.

I'm not sure why it took me so long to see him live, but golly damn.

TheRumblefish · . Joined: 29 Jan 2006 Posts: 258 Location: Florida

Sage Francis- A Healthy Distrust. For a slam poet, this guy can tear it up. Good stuff.
The Stars- Set yourself on Fire
Taking Back Sunday- Louder Now (No one sue me for this one.)
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SuperWes · Posted: Mon Aug 28, 2006 7:20 pm Post subject:

OtakupunkX · . Joined: 23 Mar 2006 Posts: 730

Dracko · . Joined: 10 Oct 2005 Posts: 2613

J.Goodwin · . Joined: 31 Jul 2006 Posts: 297 Location: North Shore, MA

This morning, I was on the train, and the train sounded like the tremelo opening to that Psychedelic Furs song that I can't remember the title of. This morning, I could only hear the opening, now I can hear the rest of the song (in my head), but still can't remember the title.
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Gamertag - FalcomAdol -- Don't Click Here 触手
Playing - Ninety-Nine Nights - Xbox 360

OtakupunkX · . Joined: 23 Mar 2006 Posts: 730

xvs07 · . Joined: 22 Sep 2005 Posts: 160

TheRumblefish · . Joined: 29 Jan 2006 Posts: 258 Location: Florida

Harveyjames · the meteor kid Joined: 06 Jul 2006 Posts: 3636

dhex · Posted: Sat Sep 09, 2006 10:09 pm Post subject:

gaaaaah. i know i'm late to the party but fuck yeah.

the new mastodon sounds like dream theatre with balls. this isn't really a good thing.
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